Will the US presidential election results be accepted by the rest of the world?

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In summary, the conversation primarily revolves around the importance of voting in a democracy and criticism of the two main presidential candidates, Bush and Kerry. Some participants express their disapproval of the political system and suggest alternative options, such as writing in a candidate or voting for local officials. It is also mentioned that education and understanding of issues are important in choosing the right candidate.
  • #1
Clausius2
Science Advisor
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You! Get your ass up of the seat and go to vote


NOW!

Democracy is one of the great advantages of our occidental civilization!


Who is going to win?...


B--K--B--K--B Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush
B--K--B--K--B Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush
B--K--B--K--B Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush
B--K--B--K--B Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush
B--K--B--K--B Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry
Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Bush Kerry Bush Kerry Bush Kerry




Hmmm... I'm not sure. :biggrin:
 
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  • #2
Ha ha ha! That's right! Go vote... NOW!
 
  • #3
uh...Nader :-p
 
  • #4
Anybody vote for the owl?
 
  • #5
The reason I will never vote is because politics is all so corrupt. They'll do anything to win the election; this includes lying, misleading and cheating.

These politicians don't really want what's best for the country, they want to be more popular with the public.

I don't think either Bush or Kerry should be president.
 
  • #6
Fritz said:
The reason I will never vote is because politics is all so corrupt. They'll do anything to win the election; this includes lying, misleading and cheating.

These politicians don't really want what's best for the country, they want to be more popular with the public.

I don't think either Bush or Kerry should be president.
You do know the ballot has more than two choices, right? Go write in a person you think should win, at the very least :rolleyes:
 
  • #7
Fritz said:
The reason I will never vote is because politics is all so corrupt. They'll do anything to win the election; this includes lying, misleading and cheating.

These politicians don't really want what's best for the country, they want to be more popular with the public.

I don't think either Bush or Kerry should be president.

I always say to people like you that waste the opportunity of the democracy (there are many countries that haven't got it) the same thing: if you don't go to vote you must be morally unable to criticize the government of the elected man.
 
  • #8
Why am I unable to critisize the government of the elected man simply because I don't go to vote? That doesn't make sense.

And it's not democracy IMO. I'm forced to choose between two morons and have no other choice.
 
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  • #9
Fritz said:
The reason I will never vote is because politics is all so corrupt. They'll do anything to win the election; this includes lying, misleading and cheating.

Fritz, you know there are more than just presidential candidates on the ballot too? If you think they are too corrupt, then get out there and vote for the state and local candidates who will someday be vying for presidential office. There are also local property tax issues and other referendum issues on the ballot.

And if you don't vote, then don't complain when you don't like who is in office the next 4 years.

These politicians don't really want what's best for the country, they want to be more popular with the public.

Fritz, the problem is the only way to win is to be the most popular candidate, so before you can do what's best for the country, you need to be the popular one. This is why we need all the most educated people who do understand the issues and how government and the world really work to get out and vote because they are the ones who can see through the simple popularity contest.

I don't think either Bush or Kerry should be president.

Unfortunately, that's how many people view this election and why it is really so close. You don't get close elections when one candidate is clearly a better leader than the other, you get close elections when a lot of people don't like either candidate, so are trying to find the lesser of two evils. This is an election where every vote truly counts. One of them will be the president for the next four years, so sift one last time through those issues and their track records, disregard the promises you're sure they won't keep, and go through the remaining few and choose the one who supports the things most important to you. There are some issues where the two candidates differ quite a bit in how they will handle them, so really give those thought.
 
  • #10
Fritz said:
Why am I unable to critisize the government of the elected man simply because I don't go to vote? That doesn't make sense.

And it's not democracy IMO. I'm forced to choose between two morons and have no other choice.

Did you vote in the primary elections? It's too late to complain about the choice available now if you didn't vote in the primary that selected who would be running for each party. If you don't like who is getting nominated, what are you doing to change it? Are you getting involved and helping some up-and-coming politicians who you think have potential to be better candidates get their start? If you want to change things at the national level, start at the local level. Work on the campaigns of some people just breaking into politics so that someday they can run for president.
 
  • #12
Moonbear said:
Fritz, you know there are more than just presidential candidates on the ballot too? If you think they are too corrupt, then get out there and vote for the state and local candidates who will someday be vying for presidential office.

Because of the nature of politics, all of the state and local are just as bad as each other. Otherwise they wouldn't even get to be candidates in the first place.

Moonbear said:
And if you don't vote, then don't complain when you don't like who is in office the next 4 years.

I have no control (the majority of people are unintelligent and misinformed, and it is the majority who dictate who will be elected).


Moonbear said:
Fritz, the problem is the only way to win is to be the most popular candidate, so before you can do what's best for the country, you need to be the popular one.

I'm sorry, but if they see through the simple popularity contest and try and make a difference, they will be thrown out of office. That's a fact.

Politics is fundamentally flawed in the US.
 
  • #13
Um, isn't this sort of topic supposed to go in the Politics and World Affairs forum?
 
  • #14
"Under the 2002 Help America Vote Act, each state must provide standby ballots to voters if they cannot be found on registration lists, are in the wrong polling place or don't have proper identification but insist they are eligible to vote. Those people will be given "provisional" ballots that will be kept separate from others until their eligibility can be confirmed."

Everyone can vote, even if you haven't registered!
 
  • #15
^ The vote doesn't count until you confirm your details. Therefore it's not really voting.
 
  • #16
Fritz said:
^ The vote doesn't count until you confirm your details. Therefore it's not really voting.

If you wanted your vote to count, you'd have your credentials confirmed. If you don't care to do that, there's no point in voting on a provisional ballot.

Fritz, this line of yours sounds all too much like an excuse, rather than a serious grievance, that you are voicing.
 
  • #17
WTF! An excuse? I'm not so lazy that I can't be bothered to vote.
 
  • #18
I just voted. At this location (small town in Wisconsin), the voting looks really heavy. My daughter voted early at the same place, and complained of the long lines. This is a good omen for Kerry, since the core voters (the "likely" voters of the polls) trend Republican.
 
  • #19
selfAdjoint said:
I just voted. At this location (small town in Wisconsin), the voting looks really heavy. My daughter voted early at the same place, and complained of the long lines. This is a good omen for Kerry, since the core voters (the "likely" voters of the polls) trend Republican.
Mmmm, I think the trend in the past has been likely voters weighted towards the Dems' with recent shifting towards the Repubs. The recent shifting towards the repubs in Polls is to correct for past overweighting of Dems..I think you may find that either the adjustment is true or still underweighting Repubs. In fact...I'd be willing to place a freindly bet on it. :biggrin:
 
  • #20
Fritz said:
The reason I will never vote is because politics is all so corrupt. They'll do anything to win the election; this includes lying, misleading and cheating.

These politicians don't really want what's best for the country, they want to be more popular with the public.

I don't think either Bush or Kerry should be president.

Wow you're really sticking it to the candidates. Of course they'll see your NOT voting as a protest against the system rather than think you're just uninformed and lazy.

If you really want to make a statement, do a write in vote and vote either 'undecided' or 'none of the candidates'. That way you won't be thought of as just another lazy person since you actually made an effort to vote.
 
  • #21
^ What would that achieve? The only purpose it would serve would be to impress the people on PF. It would just be a waste of my time.

I don't think there should even be a president in the first place.
 
  • #22
Yeah you're right. It's better to sit back and do nothing.
 
  • #23
The only reason I am not doing anything is because I don't have the power. I could try to make a difference, but I don't want to devote a lot of my time towards such a cause. I am studying engineering; I'm not interested in being a politician.
 
  • #24
I don't know about other states, but I was caught a bit off guard today to see two candidates for president in addition to Bush and Kerry on the ballot...neither of them was Nader. I don't know where these two came from and how they got onto the ballot when I've never even heard of them. They weren't listed the last time I checked the list of candidates. Now I don't even recall their names. Weird.

Anyway, I found another good reason for voting today...20% discount on Starbucks drinks if you wear your "I Voted Today" sticker that is handed out at the polls :biggrin: That alone made it worth a trip in the rain to the polls.

The line wasn't too bad where I voted, but I was there about 11 AM...non-peak hour...there was still a line, and that's the time of day when there is usually no line at all. People who voted in the morning told me the line was wrapped around 3 sides of the building where the polls were, and people were standing in that line in the rain to get their votes in! I'm always surprised to learn about voting laws in different states and how inconsistent they all are. In KY, the polls close at 6 PM! So, if you don't stand in the long line in the morning, you likely won't get there in time after work. I thought my precinct here in OH closed early at 7:30 PM. When I lived in NJ, polls would be open until 8 or 9 PM...then again, there were a lot of people who commuted to and from NYC where I lived, so needed over an hour just to get home at the end of the day.
 
  • #25
Fritz said:
Because of the nature of politics, all of the state and local are just as bad as each other. Otherwise they wouldn't even get to be candidates in the first place.

That's pretty cynical. Still, what about the local issues? Things like voting on whether to raise or lower local taxes for schools or community centers or all those sorts of things? Those don't require voting for a candidate, those you get to voice your own opinion on where you want your tax money to go. Even if you only rent, part of your rent goes toward property taxes, so you don't have to own a home for that to affect you. Those local referendums usually have a lot more influence on your day to day life than your choice of president or governor or mayor or county sheriff or coroner.
 
  • #26
I just got back from voting. I was in and out in less than 10 minutes.
 
  • #27
Moonbear said:
I don't know about other states, but I was caught a bit off guard today to see two candidates for president in addition to Bush and Kerry on the ballot...neither of them was Nader. I don't know where these two came from and how they got onto the ballot when I've never even heard of them. They weren't listed the last time I checked the list of candidates. Now I don't even recall their names. Weird.

One, I imagine, is Badnarik, the Libertarian candidate. I have no idea who the other is.
 
  • #28
There's also Cobb (Green Party), and Peroutka (Independent/Constitution Party).
 
  • #29
Peroutka (C) is on the Ballot in Ohio.
 
  • #30
Fritz said:
The only reason I am not doing anything is because I don't have the power. I could try to make a difference, but I don't want to devote a lot of my time towards such a cause. I am studying engineering; I'm not interested in being a politician.
Do you know why we have a 2 party system with two mediocre candidates (at best). Its that position right there. If you and everyone like you (10 or 20 million people) decided to exercise their vote and back a 3rd party candidate, that would change.
 
  • #31
Too bad. I can't vote since I'm not a citizen yet
 
  • #32
I'm sad :(.

Nobody has said nothing about my elaborate USA flag of the first page. :smile:


Anyway. Now we know almost the Republicans have won this elections, we want to congratulate them all, and the Democrats too. So equalled figures represents a democratic country, where no candidate has his victory assured until the last vote.

From Europe (except Great Britain and Russia) this result is viewed with scepticism. A lot of people doesn't believe americans voted Bush again in spite of "the problems" which he has been involved into. Many european governments (included the spanish one) will have to do the effort of telephoning Bush to congratulate him.
 

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