Your Religion

  • Thread starter jamesb-uk
  • Start date

negitron

Science Advisor
841
1
Why would god create parasitic wasps?
Don't you know what he did to poor Job? God's a bastard.
 

DaveC426913

Gold Member
18,294
1,904
Why would god create parasitic wasps?

Never understood why people think God should spend all his days coddling and wet-nursing people. Or why, if he does not, that makes him mean.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ivan Seeking

Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
7,093
174
They taught me thinking and reasoning skills, and applying those I realized that all modern religions (which I am familiar with) are so riddled with contradictions and nonsense that no rational thinking person would join/remain.
My experience has been that people who make such statements understand very little about religion. Generally they are speaking out of ignorance and bias.

You said yourself that you weren't actually raised to be religious, and your mother didn't even practice, so how much could you really know? How much time have you spent praying?

If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
 

Ivan Seeking

Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
7,093
174
This all reminds me a bit of the people we get here who have decided that physics is all wrong. They looked it over and made up their minds.
 

Evo

Mentor
22,870
2,348
My experience has been that people who make such statements understand very little about religion. Generally they are speaking out of ignorance and bias.

You said yourself that you weren't actually raised to be religious, and your mother didn't even practice, so how much could you really know? How much time have you spent praying?

If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
I was raised by a devoutly religious mother, I attended church every Sunday, special service every saturday evening, religious school every saturday morning. We observed all religious days. By the time I was 8 I had serious doubts that what I was being taught was not all the work of men. I could not imagine that the being they described could have mandated such atrocities and have all of the worst of human failings. When I was 11 I told my mother that I could no longer attend church as I had come to the conclusion that it was bogus. I had actually researched and writen a comparitive analysis of the largest religions as a basis for my decision. :tongue:

People that have left religion because they don't need it or see a point to it have valid opinions.
 
Last edited:

Kurdt

Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
4,769
6
You don't have to have tried everything to have an informed opinion about it Ivan. Granted there are the over zealous ignoramuses that spend any opportunity they get blindly attacking something, but that is not usually the case for the majority of people.
 
193
44
If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
well, that's the main point of agnostics/atheists against religion's after life theory.
 
248
0
How much time have you spent praying?
How much time have you spent talking to yourself, out loud, alone? The jury is in on prayer studies, no matter which Big-Man believers claim to be talking to.

If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
Even non-religious people have the ability for empathy, I mean, I know they are baby-eating Satan worshipers and all, but they are still human. :wink:

If someone is not schizophrenic, then of course they can not really know what it is like to suffer in that way, but that does not mean that they can not grasp some aspect of the experience.

We all suffer from more or less of the same kind of qualia, which is precisely why I can imagine exactly what it would be like to be fully immersed in a given cult or conspiracy theory; and why I can also accurately communicate with you all about it. On the other hand, it is much more difficult to imagine myself as, say, a fish.
 
124
0
My experience has been that people who make such statements understand very little about religion. Generally they are speaking out of ignorance and bias.

You said yourself that you weren't actually raised to be religious, and your mother didn't even practice, so how much could you really know? How much time have you spent praying?

If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
One doesn't need to spend time praying, bloodletting, or taking human/animal sacrifices to come to the conclusion that none of those religious practices work.

Aren't we getting a bit off topic here? The OP asked what reasons believers believed, but we're making comments such as:

Why would god create parasitic wasps?
Don't you know what he did to poor Job? God's a bastard.
If you have never lived it, then by definition you are clueless.
etc...

I understand many of these comments were made in jest, but one's religion (or lack of) can be a big part of who he or she is, so the person won't easily be able to hold off replying (I couldn't even help myself!). Being an atheist/non-theist/antitheist/agnostic/etc... I love a religion bashing joke as much as the next guy, but this isn't the thread to shout out contradictions/bad things in someone's religion. I sincerely want to hear why people actually believe. I don't want to see the thread get locked because we started a poo-flinging war, or pissed off a religious moderator.
 
193
44
What is the main reason you follow a religion? (not open to athiests please)
0-5 years: Agnostic
6-14: Catholic
15-current: Atheist

But recently I read about Humanism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism) and now I think my religion was/is humanism in all these years. Apparently, humanism also has many subcategories, which I haven't gone through yet. Most probably, I should be a fit on one of the categories.
 
124
0
0-5 years: Agnostic
6-14: Catholic
15-current: Atheist

But recently I read about Humanism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism) and now I think my religion was/is humanism in all these years. Apparently, humanism also has many subcategories, which I haven't gone through yet. Most probably, I should be a fit on one of the categories.
Can you claim Humanism is religious? That really goes to the definition of religion, which hasn't been established here.
 
193
44
Can you claim Humanism is religious? That really goes to the definition of religion, which hasn't been established here.
Probably not. My views in general seem to be coherent with humanism. Even if it there is an organized humanistic religion, I wouldn't probably join it. I do not enjoy the herd mentality.
 

arildno

Science Advisor
Homework Helper
Gold Member
Dearly Missed
9,948
130
I believe in my non-God because that makes sense to me and my sense of morality. :smile:
 
Its funny that people seem to ascribe all of their negative (and sometimes uninformed) opinions to the religious as a whole instead of believing that many of them may well be intelligent and thoughtful individuals.

Pupil said:
One doesn't need to spend time praying, bloodletting, or taking human/animal sacrifices to come to the conclusion that none of those religious practices work.
Prayer obviously does not work? Do you even know what prayer is?
I have met few other than children that truely believe all you have to do is pray for something and God will bring it to you if you're good, as if God is like Santa Claus or something and all you have to do is be a good little boy or girl to get your presents. To the vast majority of the religious prayer is a sort of meditation. A way to look for understanding. If you have never prayed or never prayed properly then how can you really know whether or not it 'works'?

I am not religious, never have been, and have never prayed by the way.
 
96
1
Interesting - I was just reading the spirited (no pun intended) debate in another thread on the several possible interpretations of Quantum Mechanics.

I think we all try to make sense of the world around us. We find a model that seems to 'fit' with the bulk of the data to which we have access. We 'tweek' the theory and our interpretation of it as we encounter new data and new situations. Our new experiences may give new insights into our current model, or they may cause us to question how/if our current model applies, but in rare cases, our experiences may cause us to completely abandon an old model in favor of a new one. I think this applies equally to believers and non-believers.

Personally, I follow a specific religion because I believe it to be true. I have come to that conclusion mostly through trial-and-error and personal experience. I have had my share of 'tweeks' and adjustments in my personal model of the universe. I have also had one life-altering paradigm shift.
 
248
0
I think we all try to make sense of the world around us. We find a model that seems to 'fit' with the bulk of the data to which we have access.
This is exactly where a lot of problems arise. Why is it that people feel that a model of reality that fits with their own personal experiences is any sort of argument for universal validity? What reliable data does your every day non-scientist have access to? Why is it that almost no care is taken as to the viability of the history/foundations/claims of the many religious "models" of reality? Why are people so willing to take any information at all from anyone or anything on faith? Why do people put so much stock into ideas that make them feel good?

Is the motivation for evidence-free belief really to "make sense of the world around us"?

Why is having faith considered, almost universally, as a good thing? It seems to me to be an asinine stamp of our lowly origins.
 
124
0
Its funny that people seem to ascribe all of their negative (and sometimes uninformed) opinions to the religious as a whole instead of believing that many of them may well be intelligent and thoughtful individuals.
People stereotype all the time for almost any ideal. The same could be said for political views, occupation, etc, not just religion. It's sad but true.

Prayer obviously does not work? Do you even know what prayer is?
I take the definition of prayer to be what most of the praying individuals define it to be:

- the act of communicating with a deity (especially as a petition or in adoration or contrition or thanksgiving)

- reverent petition to a deity

- someone who prays to God

- A practice of communicating with one's God

etc...

(Source www.google.com define:prayer)

If you define it to be something else, you better say so. And yes, prayer obviously does not work. Why? Personal experience, reasoned argument, and scientific studies.

I have met few other than children that truely believe all you have to do is pray for something and God will bring it to you if you're good, as if God is like Santa Claus or something and all you have to do is be a good little boy or girl to get your presents. To the vast majority of the religious prayer is a sort of meditation. A way to look for understanding. If you have never prayed or never prayed properly then how can you really know whether or not it 'works'?

I am not religious, never have been, and have never prayed by the way.
If one accepts the premise that there are no deities, then it follows that praying does not work (and that's without the studies or personal experience).
 
2,400
6
If you define it to be something else, you better say so.
I was raised in a catholic family. The priest who taught us made it pretty clear that a prayer was NOT communicating with an individual deity. He insisted that prayers for our individual good were selfish and pointless. A prayer as defined by him was the concentration of the praying person on positive thinking towards general situations or other group of people. This to my understanding is NOT meditation, but already closer than what you define. I guess I was lucky. I practiced meditation even long after I grew out of my child christianity.
 

drankin

BTW, I love my faith. It may be a complete figment of my imagination, a total illusion, but so what? It gives me more peace of mind than anything. It gives me a moral compass, direction, purpose, a sense that my life doesn't end here on earth. A sense of companionship where I would otherwise be lonely. I sense of community and brotherhood with those that share my faith. If it all turns out to be a farse, which I doubt completely, I've lost nothing but I've gained a fulfilling life that was meaningful to me and the community I've shared my faith with. I would argue that having a faith has been an evolutionary development that is hardwired into our nature. That would at least explain why so many have a faith no matter how "developed" we think we are. Why bash it. If it's not for you, then don't partake.

I think it's amazing how people can sustain themselves on shear "faith" alone against all obvious odds. Nothing to do with a religion. But it's the same mental muscle we all have.
Human beings are simply an incredible species capable of accomplishing things with nothing but faith in an idea that is not a reality until they make it so. It's the same thing people apply to their "religion". It becomes a reality to them that they live by though there is nothing tangible to an outside observer to support it. It's a human capacity we have always had. I find it a fascinating facet of being human.
 
124
0
positive thinking towards general situations or other group of people.
This seems to me to be an almost word-for-word definition of optimistic thinking.

I suppose you can define prayer that way if that's what you want, but it'll confuse a lot fewer people if you didn't.
 
248
0
BTW, I love my faith. It may be a complete figment of my imagination, a total illusion, but so what? It gives me more peace of mind than anything. It gives me a moral compass, direction, purpose, a sense that my life doesn't end here on earth. A sense of companionship where I would otherwise be lonely. I sense of community and brotherhood with those that share my faith.
This is all great and warm and fuzzy and just peachy with me; so long as you and your community stay out of my life and government affairs.



Edit: For clarification: "so long as the creeds that you and your community chose to adopt..."
 
Last edited:
2,400
6
This is all great and warm and fuzzy and just peachy with me; so long as you and your community stay out of my life and government affairs.
We have been trying hard to keep this discussion going. Thanks for your input.
 
248
0
We have been trying hard to keep this discussion going. Thanks for your input.
I'm sorry, how is the separation of church and state not relevant to religious practice?

Does my wish that others do not attempt to force upon me their own ethical and behavioral religious rules offend you?

Would you say that the religious at large do not attempt this on a massive scale everyday, as well as historically? Creationism, is a particularly succinct example.

Why can I, as a man, not marry another man, if I so wished, in most of the united states?

I hope that the wish to live and let live is not grounds for the closing of this thread.

Edit: I have added some clarification of my point to post #73.
 
Last edited:

Related Threads for: Your Religion

  • Last Post
Replies
16
Views
2K
  • Last Post
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • Last Post
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • Poll
  • Last Post
2
Replies
41
Views
3K
  • Poll
  • Last Post
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • Last Post
Replies
16
Views
2K
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • Last Post
Replies
10
Views
2K

Hot Threads

Top