Obtaining Velocity Distribution P(v) for Simple Harmonic Motion

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the possibility of analytically obtaining a velocity distribution P(v) for a particle undergoing simple harmonic motion, specifically examining the conditions under which such a distribution can be defined and compared to other types of motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether it is possible to analytically derive a velocity distribution P(v) for simple harmonic motion defined by v=sin(wt).
  • Another participant asserts that a distribution function is meaningful only when considering a large number of particles or when sampling the velocity at random times.
  • A participant recalls seeing a comparison between quantum mechanical and classical distributions for simple harmonic oscillators.
  • One participant proposes a velocity distribution for a classical particle oscillating with a sawtooth displacement, suggesting a specific form for P(v) based on discrete velocities.
  • Another participant extends the discussion to sinusoidal oscillation, providing a probability density function for position and deriving a corresponding velocity distribution function, while referencing the correspondence principle in quantum mechanics.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the concepts discussed, indicating that they do not recall seeing these ideas previously.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the applicability of distribution functions in various contexts, with some agreeing on the necessity of sampling methods while others explore different forms of motion without reaching a consensus on the validity of the proposed distributions.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the conditions under which the velocity distributions are defined, particularly in relation to the number of particles and the sampling methods used.

Mulder
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Is it possible to analytically obtain a velocity distribution P(v) for a particle, say, undergoing simple harmonic motion v=sin(wt) (between max v' and min -v', say)

I'm not sure if this is obvious, I've not come across it before.

Cheers for any feedback.
 
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A distribution function only makes sense when you have a lot of particles.
 
Tide said:
A distribution function only makes sense when you have a lot of particles.

or when you sample the particle velocity at random times. i remember seeing something like this for the simple harmonic oscillator in QM and comparing QM distribution to the Classical distribution.
 
Ok, say a classical particle in a box oscillates with a sawtooth displacement with time - it either has velocity v_0 or -v_0, then I can write a velocity distribution like

P(v)=1/2(delta (v-v_0)+delta (v+v_0)

possible for any other kind of motion?

(I'll use latex one day)
 
Mulder said:
Ok, say a classical particle in a box oscillates with a sawtooth displacement with time - it either has velocity v_0 or -v_0, then I can write a velocity distribution like

P(v)=1/2(delta (v-v_0)+delta (v+v_0)

possible for any other kind of motion?

sure. say it was a sinusoidal oscillation.

[tex]x(t) = A \mbox{sin}(\omega t + \theta)[/tex]

and you sample its position at some random time. the p.d.f. of the position is

[tex]p_x(\alpha) = \frac{1}{\pi \sqrt{A^2 - \alpha^2}}[/tex] (for [itex]|\alpha| < A[/itex], zero otherwize)

independent of [itex]\theta[/itex].

we know what the velocity function is:

[tex]v_x(t) = x^{\prime}(t) = A \omega \mbox{cos}(\omega t + \theta) = A \omega \mbox{sin}(\omega t + \theta + \pi/2)[/tex]

so the same can be applied to the velocity function (if sampled a random time):

[tex]p_v(\alpha) = \frac{1}{\pi \sqrt{(A \omega)^2 - \alpha^2}}[/tex] (for [itex]|\alpha| < A \omega[/itex], zero otherwize)

and the QM model of the harmonic oscillator will begin to look like that in an average sort of way if the wave number is high enough (which is evidence of the correspondance principle).
(I'll use latex one day)

it's useful for condoms. (pretty worthless for math.)
 
Last edited:
Thanks :cool:


Not something I remember explicitly seeing before.
 
Mulder said:
Thanks :cool:


Not something I remember explicitly seeing before.

quite all right. note that i had to fix the pdf functions a little.
 

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