Enhancing My VDG: Can I Get Better Power?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around enhancing the performance of a Van de Graaff (VDG) generator, focusing on increasing its power output for various experiments. Participants explore different materials and configurations for the generator's components, including the belt and combs, and share personal experiences and suggestions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests using a static control brush for the lower comb and a copper sphere for the receptacle to improve power.
  • Another participant humorously mentions using cats to achieve larger sparks, indicating a playful approach to the discussion.
  • There is a suggestion to research the static-production characteristics of various materials to find optimal combinations for the generator.
  • A link is provided that proposes Teflon belts with asbestos combs as a potentially effective combination, though this is later questioned regarding the conductivity of asbestos.
  • Participants discuss the necessity of having a metallic comb and the role of the rubbing block in generating static electricity, with varying opinions on materials like glass and asbestos.
  • Concerns are raised about the safety of using asbestos, prompting suggestions for alternative materials like glass for the rollers.
  • One participant shares an idea about using a treadmill to power the generator, while another humorously suggests the logistics of getting hamsters to run in the same direction to generate power.
  • There is mention of practical tips, such as using a lamp to dry the belt for better performance and demonstrating experiments with the VDG once it is operational.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a variety of opinions on the best materials and configurations for the VDG generator, indicating that multiple competing views remain. There is no consensus on the optimal approach or materials to enhance the generator's power.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific materials and configurations without fully resolving the implications of their choices. There are discussions about the safety and practicality of certain materials, such as asbestos and glass, which remain unresolved.

ExStorm1
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I built a VDG a few days ago and I was kind of saddened by it's lack of power. anything I can do to make it better?

i was thinking to use a static control brush for the lower comb, and I might try a sphere of copper for the receptacle

i don't know if my goal is viable, ut I want it to be able to raise my ~2in. hair
and maybe a few other experiments like the classic bbubble experiment

it creates about a .25-.5 in. spark at longest, and I don't know where I can get a better belt (I am currently using 'natural' spandex), how thick and what material should it be?

any suggestions?
 
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If my experience is any indication, you should toss a couple of cats in there. I've gotten 3" sparks off of Lucy. :eek:
 
haha, but i don't have any cats :(
 
Hmm... that do present a problem. Seriously, I would suggest doing what I was going to do on your behalf and link you to. Use your Google to find what sort of static-production characteristics various materials have, particularly in regard to interactions between them. I'm going to go ahead and look into it myself, but you'll probably beat me to the answers. My first Google request will be: static electricity production materials
 
Okay, here's something.
http://www.simco.nl/info/about-simco/about-static/"

It would appear from this, if I'm interpreting it correctly, that the best combination of substances for your machine would be a Teflon belt with an asbestos comb, followed by a silicone belt/glass comb set.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I thought that the combs only had to be conductive, with the rollers opposite in the Triboelectric series, with the belt neutral...plus, is asbestos even conducive?
 
Sorry... a slip of the keyboard there. I didn't mean the comb; I meant the pad or block or whatever you are rubbing your belt on to cause the static build-up. The comb should be metallic.
 
ok, so i have a nylon top roller and a silicone rubber bottom rollser with a spandex belt, i want to replace the belt... what can I use?
 
What the hell does this mean?

Error!

Error. Reason: Segment "about-static" was not a keyword for a postVarSet as expected!

It popped up just now when I tried to use my own link.

Anyhow, I might have the wrong idea about how your generator works. The ones that I've seen had some sort of rubbing block that the belt scraped as it was turning, and the comb pulled the charge off of the belt and into the ball. The composition of the rollers wasn't an issue. With a Spandex belt, it would appear that your rubbing block should be asbestos or glass. Maybe someone else should get involved here, because I'm not sure that we're talking about the same kind of machine.
 
  • #10
i wouldn't use asbestos -- rubbing it could be bad.

http://amasci.com/emotor/vdg.html

Be careful about the size you build. If you are not careful with a machine like this, you can get hurt/burned/etc.
 
  • #11
Good point about the asbestos, wx. And that's a great link. The machine there seems to be just like Ex-Storm's, and is indeed different than the one that I saw years ago.
In this case, I'd keep the silicone roller and replace the other one with glass. I don't know how easy it would be to get ahold of a glass rod big enough, but maybe a nice smooth wine bottle with the ends cut off could work.
 
  • #12
whoa, glass? that's hard to handle
 
  • #13
well easiest way is to check for better materials for rubbing, and maybe getting a faster motor, or just load more current on the current motor...

by the way, this site linked up there, is awesome, heh, i made a pendulum go crazy with an idea from that site, by using the electric field on a crt screen...
 
  • #14
ExStorm1 said:
whoa, glass? that's hard to handle
Not if you have a glass cylinder and use it as a sleeve over a wooden dowel with an axle.
 
  • #15
Wonder how hard it'd be to make one out of a treadmill...

moo
__________________
moo (moo') adj. Of no practical importance; irrelevant, such as a moo point (i.e. a cow's opinion).
 
  • #16
It's not really a matter of how hard it would be, so much as how can you get enough hamsters running in the same direction... :rolleyes:
 
  • #17
Danger said:
Not if you have a glass cylinder and use it as a sleeve over a wooden dowel with an axle.

you just need to find a fuse, and wear off the two metal caps from both sides, and there you have a glass cylinder.
 
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  • #18
Isn't there a scaling problem there?
 
  • #19
Simple idea

Sounds a bit simplistic, but I was on the Van de Graff for my school's open evening and it got so much better through the night as we put a powerful lamp right next 2 the belt to make it bone dry. But u've probably already thought of that.

A cool thing 2 do with it once its working btw, is 2 light a bunsen burner with ur finger, making sure u Earth the bunsen and insulate urself. Also piling tin foil cups on top so they fly away.
 
  • #20
It's not really a matter of how hard it would be, so much as how can you get enough hamsters running in the same direction...
Lol, I figure a cat tied to one end should do it... :biggrin:

moo
__________________
moo (moo') adj. Of no practical importance; irrelevant, such as a moo point (i.e. a cow's opinion).
 
  • #21
Well, now... you're starting to think like me. Perhaps therapy is in order.
 

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