How Far Can a Photon Travel in Our Atmosphere?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the distance that photons can travel in Earth's atmosphere, particularly in relation to atmospheric attenuation and the effects of gravity on light propagation. Participants explore the implications of special relativity, the characteristics of light sources, and detection methods.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that photons travel at the speed of light in a vacuum, but the distance they can travel in the atmosphere is affected by various factors, including atmospheric conditions and the sensitivity of detection devices.
  • One participant mentions that the concept of distance becomes meaningless from the perspective of a photon due to effects of special relativity, such as length contraction and time dilation.
  • Another participant raises concerns about the many variables involved in determining how far photons can travel before being undetectable, including the height of the light source and detector, and the atmospheric conditions.
  • It is suggested that the number of photons reaching a detector decreases with distance according to an inverse square law, which means that at some point, the signal may be lost in background noise.
  • One participant questions the feasibility of light curving around the Earth due to gravity, suggesting that the effect would be negligible unless the light source and detector were positioned at significant heights.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the factors affecting photon travel in the atmosphere, with no consensus reached on a specific distance or the impact of gravity on light propagation.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding due to the broad range of atmospheric conditions and the dependence on the specific characteristics of detection equipment.

jimma
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We know that photons can travel tremendous distances in a vacuum, but exactly how far can they travel in our atmosphere?

Thank you for any assistance.

Jimma
 
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From the viewpoint of a photon, distance has no meaning because of special relativity. The closer you travel towards the speed of light, the more length contracts in the dimension you are traveling in, and the more time slows down.

From our view point, photons travel 3 * 10^8 m/s in a vacuum. So the distance they travel is equal to whatever time interval you are observing multiplied by this speed. Note that using bose einstein condensates, photons have been slowed down to speeds approaching zero. But I assume you are talking about photons in a vacuum.
 
Thank you for your reply.

The case is concerned with atmospheric attenuation. If, say, a 150W xenon arc light source were to emit photons in a direction of a detector (intensified CCD camera or photomultiplier) how far away would the detector have to be before it registered zero sugnal, i.e. when the photons no longer reached it! Would they reach 26KM? This is of course assuming that the light was pulled around the curvature of the Earth due to gravity.

Thank you for any assistance

Jimma
 
I am only a layman and not particularly knowledgeable about optics, but I am fairly certain this question involves too many variables to be answered. I can say with certainty that Earth's gravity is nowhere near powerful enough to curve light to such a degree that will conform to the curvature of the planets surface. But, perhaps the light source and detector could be on very tall towers?

At any rate, the word "atmosphere" covers a very broad range of gaseous conditions. Also, the sensitivity of the detection device would be a major determining factor (I am not familiar with the equipment you name in your last Post). In but I do know that any detector will register a reading of "0" when the light source becomes in detectable from background radiation. Light from an arc light, just like light from a bulb or from a star, will be visible and far greater distances in the dark then in the daytime.
 
It is not a matter of the photons "not reaching" the detector.

At a large distance you can consider your lamp a point source, this means that the same number of photons pass through the surface of any sphere which is centered on the source. That means that the number of photons passing through any given portion of the sphere drops off as 1/r2. When the number of photons passing through the area captured by your detector drops below the sensitivity of the detector you will no longer be able to "see" the source. This is when your signal is lost in the noise.
 
Originally posted by jimma
We know that photons can travel tremendous distances in a vacuum, but exactly how far can they travel in our atmosphere?

Thank you for any assistance.

Jimma
As anywhere, they travel freely at C until they hit something.
 

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