What are you sure you don't know?

[Loren Booda]

Think about it; if you're absolutely sure of something, doesn't that convey complete knowledge?

[TENYEARS]

In the midst of a disaster I achived a state of certainty, it has come upon me many times in many different places. Right now though, I am a complete fool. How can I have achieved certainty if right now I am not certain? That is your riddle.

[Loren Booda]

Are you completely certain that you are now a fool? I posit a difference in the feeling of certainty and its actual being. Perhaps your present "foolishness" is more like an objectivity regarding those times of disaster.

[Imparcticle]

Think about it; if you're absolutely sure of something, doesn't that convey complete knowledge?

Not neccesrarily. You could be absolutely sure that you know the answer to something...say what
QED" is an acronym for. You're really sure to such an extent you might as well say that you're very close to thinking you know the answer. But, when you guess (because remember, you never knew the answer, you were just quite sure) that it stands for "Quantum Earth Dynamics". But you are dismayed to know that it actually stands for "Quantum Electrodynamics" :frown: .
So there is no "complete knowledge".
Also, that term can be subjective, right?

[TENYEARS]

I am a fool for speaking what I know and having this ever so slight bit of hope that the course of the future can be altered. And yet what is one to do with ones life? Is any one act better or worse than any other? I speak what I speak because it is and only because it is.

Certainty(My definition) - A state beyond doubt, beyond convinced. Pure knowing. It will always be in accordance with reality as known or unknown.

[Hugo Holbling]

Think about it; if you're absolutely sure of something, doesn't that convey complete knowledge?

I think it may depend on what you mean by knowledge.

[Rader]

Think about it; if you're absolutely sure of something, doesn't that convey complete knowledge?

I think I am not sure, that maybe anyone can be sure of something but nobody sure of everything.

Maybe knowledge is just one unified thought, that we continually interprete individually as new ideas.

[Evo]

Think about it; if you're absolutely sure of something, doesn't that convey complete knowledge?That would depend to what degree you want to take the statement "complete knowledge". I can be certain something is a rock, I have complete knowledge that it is in fact a rock, but that doesn't mean I have complete knowledge of the rock's composition or formation.

[Imparcticle]

What makes a rock a rock, by the way Evo?

[outandbeyond2004]

In the final analysis, one can be sure of this: You have to take a chance you know something, or guess at the right course of action to take.

The only things I am sure of: I exist, whatever that means. I live, whatever that means. Anything else I try not to worry too much about knowing.

[Evo]

What makes a rock a rock, by the way Evo?According to the dictionary: A naturally formed aggregate of mineral matter constituting a significant part of the earth's crust; Relatively hard, naturally formed mineral or petrified matter; stone; consolidated or unconsolidated solid mineral matter.

[outandbeyond2004]

Evo, you *know* that your dictionary is always right . . . right?

[Architeuthis Dux]

Here is something I am sure I don't know: the relationship between brain chemistry and emotion.

According to the neurologists, depressed, angry, and unhappy moods are associated with certain chemicals in the brain. Happiness and contentment are associated with others.

But are emotions the effect of brain chemistry, or are they the cause?

In other words, if I am unhappy with my life, should I seek a more rewarding life, or should I just take pills to make me happy with the life I have?

[Rader]

Here is something I am sure I don't know: the relationship between brain chemistry and emotion.

According to the neurologists, depressed, angry, and unhappy moods are associated with certain chemicals in the brain. Happiness and contentment are associated with others.

But are emotions the effect of brain chemistry, or are they the cause?

In other words, if I am unhappy with my life, should I seek a more rewarding life, or should I just take pills to make me happy with the life I have?

It seems, they are both necessary to have human exprience. Changes in the mind makes changes in the body and visa versa. Maybe life is a roadmap to find the right path.

[Loren Booda]

Back to the origin:

Can you not realize anything that you are completely certain of?

[TENYEARS]

I do not know if there are any limitations other than what I place upon myself. I have tried four barriers and broken four. I suppose I do not know if I will break any more in this life time.

[Evo]

Evo, you *know* that your dictionary is always right . . . right?No, I don't believe that. But I *do* know what a rock is. :biggrin:

[outandbeyond2004]

I am sure that I do not know that I will die. Not that I believe I will live forever . . .

[Odin]

That would depend to what degree you want to take the statement "complete knowledge". I can be certain something is a rock, I have complete knowledge that it is in fact a rock, but that doesn't mean I have complete knowledge of the rock's composition or formation.
You are right, You are completely sure that to the extent of your knowledge and abilities that the rock you hold in your hand is infact a rock, Complete Knowledge is something different though, it is the fact that whatever the circumstance, whatever happened what you know is true right now can be proved with better and better equipment as time trudges on and technology improves, so at the moment that rock is a rock to your best knowledge and abilities but in 100 years time it might be 97% solid magma, 2% dirt and 1%Iron.

[olde drunk]

as long as i live in an eternal, infinite universe or omniverse, i will NEVER be certain of anything. once i no longer desire to expand my awareness, i will cease to exist.

oops, i'm not certain of that either.


love & peace,

[loseyourname]

I am certain that I can't divide a number by zero.

[TENYEARS]

Are you sure? Or is it that your present program cannot deal with the result? Or can it?

[loseyourname]

No, I'm sure. Go ahead and try. Take any number of rocks, it doesn't matter how many, and try to put them into zero groups. I guarantee that you can't do it.

[Loren Booda]

Redefine zero.

[loseyourname]

Why would I redefine zero? I am certain that I cannot put any number of rocks (as I understand the concept of numbers and rocks) into zero groups (as I understand the concept of zero). Redefining it is pointless. As the definitions stand, I am certain.

[Odin]

Why would I redefine zero? I am certain that I cannot put any number of rocks (as I understand the concept of numbers and rocks) into zero groups (as I understand the concept of zero). Redefining it is pointless. As the definitions stand, I am certain.
Tell me this can you ever say that you have seen zero? I don't mean zero rocks or zero numbers, I'm talking about the absence of anything. Zero is the absence of both positive and negative. So... have you ever seen nothing, complete nothing? My point is how can you group rocks into zero if you have never seen or at the very least experienced zero or nothing?How do you know that it even exists at all apart from the human termanology for it which is basically saying I dont have or owe anyone any rocks. But that is only specific to rocks, I mean you might on the other hand have 20 apples and owe some bastard over there 10 oranges. But then again I have zero quableducks, is that because they don't exist or because I neither have any nor owe anybody any?
So in conclusion, how can you say that you can't put any number of rocks into groups of zero when you haven't experienced what zero really is or even seen if it exists in the first place?

[loseyourname]

Then put rocks, or anything else, into a group of zero. No matter how you twist language, you can't do it. Of that, I am certain.

[Loren Booda]

A group of zero rocks means to me that I can neither observe it physically nor represent it through counting, not that it does not exist. How otherwise could I have a concept of a rock if I did not know what it wasn't?

[loseyourname]

Are you trying to say a group of zero rocks can have a physical existence? I am still certain that it can't.

Heck, expand the horizon and take out all number symbols. Put any amount of anything nowhere. You can't do it. Of that I am certain, if only because of the non-existence of nowhere.

[loseyourname]

By the way, what it means to you is irrelevant. As the common definition of zero stands, it means an empty set. An empty set cannot contain anything, which means it cannot contain any rocks.

[Loren Booda]

Just wondering: how can an undefined set {1/0} operate exclusively on a defined set {0,1}?

[loseyourname]

I'm not a mathematician, and I don't know. What I do know is that you will never put anything into zero groups, no matter how you try to argue out of it. You will never do it, and you can never do it.

[Odin]

Are you trying to say a group of zero rocks can have a physical existence? I am still certain that it can't.

Heck, expand the horizon and take out all number symbols. Put any amount of anything nowhere. You can't do it. Of that I am certain, if only because of the non-existence of nowhere.

How do you know that a group of zero rocks cannot have a physical existance? Don't you get it my point is that you have not seen that zero does or does not exist... whether or not your reasoning and background have taught you what you think! I'm saying sure your certain that it cannot exist to YOUR limited knowledge but... in simple terms... prove it...

As a matter of fact if you do I will give you a group of 0/$1,000,000 which will be much use to you, since you will be able to see it you should be able to convert it into existing money with your obviously awesome power in maths...

[tabloid]

the only thing that i dont know is what i cant predict;what will happen the next second?...i honestly dont know.

[loseyourname]

You're missing the point, Odin. If my knowledge is limited, then I can still be certain that I don't know. That was the question being addressed.