How does changing flux produce a field.

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Yuqing
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Field Flux
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the concept of how changing magnetic flux induces an electric field, exploring both classical and quantum perspectives. Participants question the foundational understanding of this phenomenon, whether it is purely mathematical or if there is an intuitive basis behind it.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express difficulty in visualizing how changing magnetic flux produces an electric field, questioning whether this is a derived phenomenon or if it has an intuitive explanation.
  • It is noted that Maxwell's equations are based on experimental data and serve as foundational principles in classical electromagnetics.
  • There is a suggestion that the phenomenon could be seen as an axiom, with uncertainty about whether a fundamental understanding exists.
  • One participant mentions that while the phenomenon is counterintuitive, it has been observed experimentally, leading to mathematical descriptions.
  • A later reply introduces the idea that in quantum mechanics, the properties of the electromagnetic field can be derived from Coulomb's law and special relativity, although this is not how magnetic fields were historically discovered.
  • Another participant raises the question of why the universe exhibits local U(1) gauge symmetry, indicating a deeper inquiry into the nature of these principles.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying degrees of uncertainty regarding the fundamental understanding of the phenomenon. While some suggest it may be axiomatic, others point to derivations from established laws, indicating that multiple competing views remain without consensus.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding the intuitive aspects of changing flux and its relation to field induction, as well as the historical context of how these concepts were developed.

Yuqing
Messages
216
Reaction score
0
I have some trouble understanding how changing flux produces a field. For example, I know that a changing magnetic field will induce an electric field because the flux of the magnetic field is changing. But how does this change in flux create the electric field. I just can't picture it.

Is it a purely derived phenomenon worked out from mathematics and empirical observations or is there a certain level of intuition behind it?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
In classical electromagnetics, Maxwell's equations are pretty much first principles. There isn't any theory that you can use to derive them outside of experimental data. How do you explain a changing magnetic field inducing an electric field?
 
So is it simply an effect that was mathematically derived?

Is there perhaps some analogy or example that can help explain this phenomenon?
 
It was observed experimentally (and then you can write equations to describe the observations, of course). Now that you mention it, though, it is slightly counterintuitive - I can't think of a good analogy of something more directly observable.
 
Am I right in saying that the phenomenon of changing flux inducing a field is just an axiom? Do we fundamentally understand why it occurs?
 
Moving into quantum mechanics, we can say that Maxwell's Equations are the way they are because the universe has local U(1) gauge symmetry.

Of course, this begs the question, "why does the universe have local U(1) gauge symmetry?" :rolleyes:

The bottom line is, we always come to a point where we just have to shrug and say, "that's the way things are," at least until someone finds a deeper explanation.
 
Do we fundamentally understand why it occurs?

Yes, all the dynamical properties of the electromagnetic field can be derived from coulomb's law + special relativity. This is not how magnetic fields were discovered historically, of course.

The fun part is that in quantum mechanics you don't even need coulombs law, just the relativistic equation of motion for a free particle together withthe principle of locality is sufficient to derive the existence of a field with the properties of E&M.

"why does the universe have local U(1) gauge symmetry?"

Quantum states are only detemined up to a phase, which corresonds to a global U(1) invariance, while the principle of locality promotes it to a local U(1) invariance. This is not how local gauge symmetry was discovered historically, of course.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
3K
  • · Replies 42 ·
2
Replies
42
Views
4K