Hypocrit EU builds Apartheid Wall

[kat]

EU to build wall after blasting Israel's (http://worldnetdaily.com/news/printer-friendly.asp?ARTICLE_ID=39998)

[GENIERE]

Let’s hope the wall does as well keeping people in as it does keeping people out.

[Adam]

For those whe don't know, Britain has had such walls, or fences, for years. As has France. They built them around the ends of the Chunnel.

[wasteofo2]

AWESOME! Maybe now we can get the French to help us build a wall between Texas and Mexico...

[plus]

The EU and especially Britain are entitled to build fences to keep out illegal immigrants, as it saves a lot of hassle. In this manner, one can more effectively monitor the people living in the countries. This helps with regard to crime and tax matters. The number of indians/ chinese/ pakistanis which enter the EU by way of these borders is huge. Only legal assylum seekers (non of which should come from these countries) should be allowed to enter. Similarly, I do not see what is wrong about monitoring the italian/ spanish coastline to try to halt african illegal immigrants.

To blast anyone caring about such immigration is very harmful.

[Monique]

So how did Israel's security fence violate international law? The EU is just reinforcing borders that are already there.

I lived in Detroit and there is one of the most active border crossing between the US and Canada, getting out of the US is easy.. getting in is a whole other story.

[plus]

getting out of the US is easy.. getting in is a whole other story.

It is easy to get into the US as testified by the large numbers of mexicans in the south.

[Monique]

At official border crossings such as the one in Detroit. Even with a valid visa you get fired with a lot of questions before they let you in (and I'm not even a suspicious looking person :wink: or from a problematic country).

[Dissident Dan]

I do not like these EU fences, and this is pretty hypocritical, although the walls are for different purposes.

[Adam]

For those who don't know, the USA has fences in various places along the border with Mexico, as WasteofO2 pointed out. The USA has men with guns patrolling points of access. You go through security checkpoints, and they have the face of Bush staring stupidly from posters all over the place, while the men with guns stand by just in case. Metal detectors, chemical sniffers, firearms, dogs, and all manner of deadly obstacles await any attempting to enter the USA though even a regular civilian airport.

Most countries have the same, and have had such for a very long time.

[Monique]

I do not like these EU fences, and this is pretty hypocritical, although the walls are for different purposes.
Why is it hypocritical?

[Dissident Dan]

Why is it hypocritical?

They decried Israel's wall and put up their own. The EU's wall probably does not have the same capacity to increase tensions in an already-tense area as Israel's wall does, though.

[jcsd]

If the EU built their wall outside of the EU then you might have a point. Israel's wall is not actually in Israel.

[kat]

They decried Israel's wall and put up their own. The EU's wall probably does not have the same capacity to increase tensions in an already-tense area as Israel's wall does, though.
No it's being put up to protect their heritage and their economy as opposed to protecting people from being murdered.

[Monique]

So I'll ask again: how did Israel's security fence violate international law?

[jcsd]

http://www.icj-cij.org/icjwww/idocket/imwp/imwpframe.htm

[Monique]

Would the fence around my garden be a problem too?

[jcsd]

Would the fence around my garden be a problem too?

If you built in your neighbours garden, yes.

[Monique]

Exactly :approve:

[Adam]

So I'll ask again: how did Israel's security fence violate international law?

That bit about "ethnic cleansing"...

[kat]

Adam and his convuluted claims strike again.

[GENIERE]

Adam and his convuluted claims strike again.
As a Convolutionist, I'm offended. :biggrin: :biggrin:

[kat]

Lol, sorry!

[Adam]

Baseless assertions again, Kat? Do you need me to provide you with definitions again? Very well.

The systematic elimination of an ethnic group or groups from a region or society, as by deportation, forced emigration, or genocide.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=ethnic%20cleansing

The wall is a method of excluding Palestinians from an area. Thus, it is ethnic cleansing.

[4newton]

So how did Israel's security fence violate international law? The EU is just reinforcing borders that are already there.

Israel has a responsibility to take care of the land and the people that it controls.
It is illegal and immoral to disregard that responsibility.

If Israel wishes to have an independent country then they must give up control and help Palestine become an independent country.

There will never be peace in the Holy Land until there is a change in attitude. Israel must give up the idea of an eye for an eye. Instead of destroying homes they should build houses and hospitals for the people of Palestine.

It is not difficult to see the end result if things do not change. The first or second country in the Middle East that gets nuclear weapons will use them on Israel.

That time is at most 10 to 20 years away.

It may even be less if you take note that we have no support for trying to stabilize the Middle East and prevent the spread of nuclear weapons.

The people of the world have no view of what is taking place and are not supporting the US effort.

[Hurkyl]

The wall is a method of excluding Palestinians from an area. Thus, it is ethnic cleansing.

Funny, the wall does not: commit genocide, force emigration, or deport anyone.

It merely impedes passage from one side to the other: it is not capable of relocation, and therefore cannot eliminate an ethnic group from a region.



Israel has a responsibility to take care of the land and the people that it controls ...

Maybe if condemnations of Israel would be more convincing if they didn't pretend there is one side to every issue. *shrug*

[Adam]

Funny, the wall does not: commit genocide, force emigration, or deport anyone.

It merely impedes passage from one side to the other: it is not capable of relocation, and therefore cannot eliminate an ethnic group from a region.

Nor did Germany's bullets during WW2 commit ethnic cleansing, right? Think before typing, dude.

[studentx]

Nor did Germany's bullets during WW2 commit ethnic cleansing, right? Think before typing, dude.

Nobody claimed german bullets were behind the ethnic cleansing.... dude..

[Adam]

Studentx, to put it simply, you just don't get it. Sit back and wait for the rubber ball.

[studentx]

I got it, but your point was so flawed i had to hold the mirror. Yeah its not pretty is it

[Adam]

Anyone got a brick wall I can bang my head against?

[GENIERE]

Padded room?

[Adam]

I may need it soon.

[4newton]

>Maybe if condemnations of Israel would be more convincing if they didn't pretend there is one side to every issue. *shrug*<

My statement is not condemning Israel. It is pointing out that with the power goes the responsibility. I agree that the other side is irrational but they do not have that ability to change anything. Israel does have the power to change and must bear the responsibility for change. The most egregious policy that can not be justified is the method of new settlements. It is used to control more land and it makes a statement that peace in not the goal. If the question is more room for more people it then makes sense to expand established towns in a limited area.

The ideas I have presented are logical not emotional they will of course be ignored in favor of emotion.

[Hurkyl]

Nor did Germany's bullets during WW2 commit ethnic cleansing, right? Think before typing, dude.

Since you did not contest my statement, I presume you agree that you were mistaken in claiming the wall is ethnic cleansing.


Why would you say that bullets would not be ethnic cleansing? A bullet is certainly capable of eliminating a person.

[Adam]

The wall is not ethnic cleansing in precisely the same way that NAZI death camps were not ethnic cleansing. The wall is a part of ethnic cleansing in precisely the same way that NAZI death camps were a part of ethnic cleansing.

And a wall is certainly capable of keeping a person out of an area.

[studentx]

keeping a person out of an area isnt ethnic cleansing. Forcefully emigrating is

[Monique]

comparing a wall with death camps.. right.. wouldn't the berlin wall be a better comparison?

[Adam]

Monique, it was a form of analogy, for example: hand is to glove as foot is to boot. That is not saying hands and feet are the same thing. It is merely a method of comparison.

[Monique]

Yeah, comparing apples with pears.

[tumor]

Europeans don't build any wall, just more barbed wire and such,you can not compare this to the 10 meter high wall!
And borders In Europe are legitimate, unlike Palestine/Israel.
But it feels good to jump on the Bad Europe and Evil France band wagon as usual.