Female engineering student?

[VikFloyd]

I like math and science. I am good at math. I really would like to study engineering. My only problem is if I face sexism. I must admit I am very sensitive. I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me. If you were/was an engineering student, did you see any of your female classmates getting attacked by sexist comments?

[Floid]

Nope

[Pengwuino]

I like math and science. I am good at math. I really would like to study engineering. My only problem is if I face sexism. I must admit I am very sensitive. I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me. If you were/was an engineering student, did you see any of your female classmates getting attacked by sexist comments?

Why do you think any of this would be exclusive to engineering?

[VikFloyd]

Why do you think any of this would be exclusive to engineering?


I'm just trying to encourage myself to study engineering but I sometimes feel discouraged.

[Pengwuino]

I'm just trying to encourage myself to study engineering but I sometimes feel discouraged.

Why are you discouraged? I mean, if it's because you think people will treat you weird because you're a female engineer, then you should get over that. People may say you're weird for being an engineer, but college is not about gaining acceptance from anyone. It's about doing your classes, passing them, and getting your degree.

[johnbbahm]

We need more engineers! The sex of the engineer is not even part of the equation. If you have the math skills, you will earn the respect of your classmates. Creating elegant solutions to complex problems, is one of the greatest aspirations of humanity.

[turbo]

When I started in engineering at Orono, there were 305 students. 5 were females.

Please look at your vocation and your job prospects and don't spend too much time on gender. You can do well - just learn the course-work and learn how to apply that material.

[xxChrisxx]

I like math and science. I am good at math. I really would like to study engineering. My only problem is if I face sexism. I must admit I am very sensitive. I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me. If you were/was an engineering student, did you see any of your female classmates getting attacked by sexist comments?

With an attitude you'll get nowhere im afraid. If you are that scared of what someone is going to say to you in a classroom you'll get bullied to hell by clients. I think i'm pretty strong willed, don't really care what people think or say and I get beaten into a corner by them.

I did motorsports, so yes we were sexist towards the two girls on the course, more becuase we all ribbed each other and they were treated no different. They gave as good as they got.

Anyway what are you doing on a science forum? Shouldn't you be here (http://www.discusscooking.com/forums/)?

Why do you care what someone says anyway? I'm clearly just an idiot on a forum. You've got to distinguish between joking sexism whcih you WILL get and real sexism, which i've never seen at university

[VikFloyd]

With an attitude you'll get nowhere im afraid. If you are that scared of what someone is going to say to you in a classroom you'll get bullied to hell by clients. I think i'm pretty strong willed, don't really care what people think or say and I get beaten into a corner by them.

I did motorsports, so yes we were sexist towards the two girls on the course, more becuase we all ribbed each other and they were treated no different. They gave as good as they got.

Anyway what are you doing on a science forum? Shouldn't you be here (http://www.discusscooking.com/forums/)?

Why do you care what someone says anyway? I'm clearly just an idiot on a forum. You've got to distinguish between joking sexism whcih you WILL get and real sexism, which i've never seen at university


Hahahahaha! I'm just a little paranoid. Let's just say high school years were hell for me and some of that is still with me. I am contemplating nursing as well which is another problem. I don't know which one to choose.

[turbo]

Hahahahaha! I'm just a little paranoid. Let's just say high school years were hell for me and some of that is still with me. I am contemplating nursing as well which is another problem. I don't know which one to choose.Nursing can be wearing on you, unless you are really thick-skinned. You'll see a lot of pain and suffering that many of us are insulated from. I have a few friends who are nurses. Only one is still married to her HS boyfriend, and she is an ER nurse who sees a lot of the most critical cases roll through those doors.

[VikFloyd]

I am unsure which on to do. I like the idea of nursing and engineering. I am also looking at which one will get me a job the fastest and easiest. I heard engineering is a lot of work. My mother's a nurse so that is kind of encouraging me to go for nursing. I just need to know the pros and cons of each.

[brewnog]

I think it's your attitude that's the problem, not that of your prospective classmates. Just prove yourself as a good engineer like everyone else has to. Engineering is naturally an environment where there's a lot of pisstaking (regardless of your demographic), respect has to be earned.

[Ranger Mike]

when i was in college..after failing calculus the second time ...i was told ."Mike ..the world need ditch digger too"
personally i have never been harassed about my sex....

[jhae2.718]

I haven't heard any sexist comments directed towards female engineering students in any of my classes. Don't worry about it.

[VikFloyd]

Thanks people! :smile: My next question is which is better engineering or nursing?

[Ranger Mike]

i gotta tell you the dollars are in nursing..way big dollars..right now..after obama care hits...big government may start to regulate your wages...ask you mom about the take home pay and what she is being told about her job future..

[Angry Citizen]

I'm a male engineering student, and I'd be incredibly happy to befriend a female engineering student. I think women are highly underrepresented in the profession, and girls + brains = awesome. I think you'll find a lot of the nerdier engineers would be just as happy to see you there. The times are changing. Don't be afraid of other people's opinions.

As for 'better', I think engineering is better than nursing, but I'm an engineering student. If you're good at math and science, and enjoy the thought of designing complex machinery, then I wouldn't "waste" my time in nursing. Anyone can be a nurse, judging from the quality of nursing students I've seen. Not anyone can be an engineer.

Also, the guy above me is paranoid and clearly a right-winger with a tremendous bias and a chip on his shoulder... Engineers typically start out with salaries on the order of USD50k/60k, and double that after about a decade.

[VikFloyd]

I like the sound of that! This is a tough decision! I also put in mind which is easier to build up a good resume. I am looking for a job that reflects upon my major.

[daveb]

My niece got her degree in nursing and right out of college went on to about 75k per year.

[I like Serena]

Thanks people! :smile: My next question is which is better engineering or nursing?

You're asking in the wrong place.

Everyone here will say.... uhh nursing is better!
As where the big bucks are, everyone here will say.... uhh, nursing!
And the place where working circumstances are easy on you.... uhh, nursing! :smile:

However, if you want to know where you're doing a social job, helping people, taking care of their needs..... uhh engineering! :wink:

[Pengwuino]

I'm a male engineering student, and I'd be incredibly happy to befriend a female engineering student. I think women are highly underrepresented in the profession, and girls + brains = awesome. I think you'll find a lot of the nerdier engineers would be just as happy to see you there. The times are changing. Don't be afraid of other people's opinions.

Yah nothing like telling a girl that the guys will be drooling all over her if she becomes an engineering major.

I like the sound of that! This is a tough decision! I also put in mind which is easier to build up a good resume. I am looking for a job that reflects upon my major.

You're looking at this career decision the wrong way. If you don't like being a nurse and still do it, you'll eventually crash and burn. If you don't like being an engineer and still do it, you'll eventually crash and burn. Engineering is hard but nursing has it's own difficulties. There is no "better" job field. And no amount of money can make you happy doing a job you dislike.

[Angry Citizen]

Yah nothing like telling a girl that the guys will be drooling all over her if she becomes an engineering major.


Oh grow up. She asked if she'd encounter hateful and sexist comments. She won't. I didn't say they'd be drooling over her. I said I for one wouldn't bat an eye at the prospect of befriending a female engineer. As a feminist, I merely stated that sexism is going away in the engineering profession, at least among students. Sure, the nerds will be curious, and rightfully so (the 5:1 ratio of males to females in engineering makes it rather difficult to find someone who is motivated by the same professional interests that you are); however, she won't be 'drooled on'. In fact, by saying what you said, I actually regret making my comment, because apparently sexism isn't as dead as I thought it was...

[Pengwuino]

Oh grow up. She asked if she'd encounter hateful and sexist comments. She won't. I didn't say they'd be drooling over her. I said I for one wouldn't bat an eye at the prospect of befriending a female engineer. As a feminist, I merely stated that sexism is going away in the engineering profession, at least among students. Sure, the nerds will be curious, and rightfully so (the 5:1 ratio of males to females in engineering makes it rather difficult to find someone who is motivated by the same professional interests that you are); however, she won't be 'drooled on'. In fact, by saying what you said, I actually regret making my comment, because apparently sexism isn't as dead as I thought it was...

Don't try to BS us. You said what you said and we all know how students can be.

[MATLABdude]

At my university, there seem to be at least two programs that are majority female (over 50+% of the undergraduates) chemical and materials. No idea why, it just seems to be that way.

I think the overall female / male undergrad ratio sits at about 40/60. Programs designed to bring girls into engineering and sciences (if you have the talent, why shouldn't you be a science / engineering student) have gone a long way towards increasing this ratio. The Civil Engineering building (built somewhere between the 1940s and 1960s) used to have male / female washrooms on alternating floors, prior to a recent gutting / renovation.

The reason? When the building was first designed, the architects / engineers decided that there weren't any women in engineering, and so didn't bother to put in women's washrooms (except on the administration, okay secretarial, floor). Norms and attitudes change: If you don't want to be subject to stereotypes, don't subscribe to them. You may find someone (and this will be exceedingly rare) that is flat-out misogynistic (racist, antisemitic, etc.) and probably more people that aren't maliciously so, but have certain stereotypes in mind for various groups of people, but you won't see any official sanctioning of this at any major university in the US / Canada / Europe.

EDIT: Meant to say that abusive behaviour / language is seldom ever tolerated and usually penalized under honour codes.

[Pengwuino]

This reminds me of

http://xkcd.com/385/

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/how_it_works.png

Oddly enough, a couple of years back girls had surpassed boys in mathematical standardized testing and are probably doing even better this year. Couple that with the fact that I believe the college graduate ratio is now 6 girls for every 4 boys graduating (or we're closing in on that ratio) and one wonders when guys will become the exception rather than the rule in science.

I personally subscribe to the idea that if you let two people work with a certain person, tell one of those two people that the person they're going to be working with is racist or sexist, that person is going to find a reason to believe they're racist or sexist while the other won't. We had two girls in our physics department while I was attending. One thought that physics was a sexist field and certain professors were sexist. The other didn't think that at all. Of course, wouldn't you know it, the first girl dropped out and complained the department was sexist. The straw that broke the camels back apparently was an e/m test being too hard. Yes.... the exact same test everyone else took (also the test she didn't bother studying for or really do the homework for). I have no idea how you equate a hard test that was given to everyone as sexist but that was the logic.

[VikFloyd]

For some reason I strengthened up yesterday. I am not scared all that much anymore. Besides, people always say I look unapproachable the first time I meet them or that they think I am going to be mean.

@ Pengwuino That reminds me of the students at my school. Once they fail a test and it is clearly their own fault they blame the professor instead of themselves. I must admit, I have never thought to myself, "Awww I did bad on this test because I'm a girl!" I would assume I did bad on it because I didn't study at all or I didn't study hard enough. Everytime I study, I pass. Everytime I don't study, I fail.

@Angry Citizen Hopefully none of the guys are attractive (which I bet they will be) because I get kind of nervous around cute guys hahahaha

[turbo]

@Angry Citizen Hopefully none of the guys are attractive (which I bet they will be) because I get kind of nervous around cute guys hahahahaIf you are the kind of person to love engineering, you'll probably find even geeky, awkward guys very attractive, even if they aren't "cute". Life is that way.

[timthereaper]

I would think engineering programs would be much better off if more women chose to apply to them. It can be seen as a boys' club sometimes and I think that's only due to the fact that a few decades ago men and women were relegated to specific roles. You could arguably make the same kind of case for male nurses like for women engineers. I think this kind of thinking is propagated by older professors and engineers who studied engineering when these opinions held more sway. I can totally imagine it being a bit unnerving walking into a classroom filled with men and you being the only woman (I've felt that way before in reverse), but despite this hopefully we'll see more women engineers in the future.

[Kenneth Mann]

I say 'go for it'. Sure, there will be male sexism in school, but what I have found out is that it is usually used to cover-up fears of inadequacy on the part of those who make the most bluster. Rarely do the really top students behave in that manner. In fact, they are usually willing to work with you with the attitude that they can gain more by sharing more - - much like the participants on this forum.

The reward, however, is in the workplace. There, the proportion of women has always been relatively low - - probably because of the stereotypes that develop within the schools, (especially grade schools) which then serve to filter out the capable female participants. Most workplaces are so happy to get women as engineers that they'll almost bend over backward for them. And, when the resulting advantages are offered, I say accept them.

This isn't to say that engineers can't be snotty. You'll find the same bad behavior that is found elsewhere - - especially coming from those who feel themselves to be lacking in capability, so beware of the generic a--hole wherever you are.

KLM

[DuncanM]

I like math and science. I am good at math. I really would like to study engineering. My only problem is if I face sexism. I must admit I am very sensitive. I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me. If you were/was an engineering student, did you see any of your female classmates getting attacked by sexist comments?

I wouldn't let concerns about sexist comments deter you from entering engineering. If that is what you want to do, go for it.

I don't recall any of my female classmates being specifically attacked for being female. They always did well and were always in the top quarter of the class in terms of marks.

However, if you are worried about getting into some uncomfortable situations around a group of guys, well, that can happen anywhere. It can happen outside of school or work too. For example, maybe you are out with your brother and a group of his friends and they start talking about how hot some girls are or how unhot others are. Those sorts of situations might make you uncomfortable, but they are not specific to school or engineering. (Come to think of it, I have been in some groups of women and their conversations sometimes turned more explicit than the conversations men have.) People talk. It is what they do. Don't base your decisions on such a trivial matter.

[Astronuc]

I am unsure which on to do. I like the idea of nursing and engineering. I am also looking at which one will get me a job the fastest and easiest. I heard engineering is a lot of work. My mother's a nurse so that is kind of encouraging me to go for nursing. I just need to know the pros and cons of each. Do what you enjoy.

If one wants to studying engineering, then go for it. One should study engineering, because one wants to do so, not because someone else thinks one should.

Math, science and engineering require a lot of work. Actually, competence and mastery in any subject requires effort. To be a competent nurse takes effort.

Their were two women in my nuclear engineering program and others in health physics. All of us students in the program encouraged each other. None of us tolerated sexist nonsense.
I am unsure which on to do. I like the idea of nursing and engineering. I am also looking at which one will get me a job the fastest and easiest. I heard engineering is a lot of work. My mother's a nurse so that is kind of encouraging me to go for nursing. I just need to know the pros and cons of each. Then consider perhaps, bioengineering.

[rootX]

You need to fix your weak character* and I believe engineering would be best for that!

*you cannot live your whole life making decisions based on what's more comfortable.

I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me.
Learn to fight :tongue2:

[sweetpotato]

As a female electrical engineer I thought I'd a few words. I graduated with a BS this spring and the only sexism/uncomfortable comments I had to deal with were from a few female non-engineering students (they basically thought I was weird) and from an elderly and conservative male professor who was known for being mean to both male and female students (basically he made a sexist joke in class, which I would have tolerated from a student but coming from a professor I found it inappropriate). I ended up getting a good grade in his class, though.


I don't think you should make your decision on nursing vs. engineering based on the ratio of women in the field, but based on what you think you would enjoy doing for the rest of your life- nursing or engineering.

If it's very important to you to work in a field that has a higher ratio of women, study bioengineering, biomedical engineering, chemical engineering, or environmental engineering. For some reason, the amount of women in these fields are higher than in other engineering fields such as electrical or mechanical. Honestly, when I was in college I didn't mind the scarcity of women in my major, but at my current job, when I'm the only female engineer, I often feel that my coworkers are somewhat uncomfortable dealing with me (they seem to be particularly polite when talking to me, and prefer to direct questions to my male colleague even if I am the one who is more likely to know the answer).

My point is that I think you have a valid concern, but it doesn't justify abandoning the idea of studying engineering if that's what you would truly enjoy. I, for one, have no plans to change careers in the future.

[HeLiXe]

I like math and science. I am good at math. I really would like to study engineering. My only problem is if I face sexism. I must admit I am very sensitive. I fear coming across mean male classmates who will always say sexist comments about me. If you were/was an engineering student, did you see any of your female classmates getting attacked by sexist comments?

You may encounter it, but do not let it stop you from doing what you love.

[nocturne-e]

As one of two girls in the entire school taking AP physics C this past year, I faced probably - actually, most definitely - what would be considered sexual harassment from some of my male peers. I probably should have stuck up for myself more, but I knew that in most cases they were just trolling and didn't get too offended by what was said to me. I was an easy target, but when they were close to failing and I was making solid As, my grades spoke for themselves.

The most.. interesting.. experience I had during that class was when the guy sitting next to me asked me out in front of about two whole rows of other guys. When they say, "do you want to help me study" and then mention, "at a nice restaurant" or "alone," be careful. Just sayin'


BUT, that was high school and I doubt I will have any problems like this when I go to college in the fall. I am thankful that I was exposed to this in some ways because now I know what to look out for. Just try not to take things personally that aren't meant to be personal - but be ready to stand up for yourself when things are said that are out of line or make you feel uncomfortable.

[turbo]

@OP, do you think that you can handle the emotional demands of nursing? You can spend weeks and weeks calculating the water demands for a cooling system with no emotional baggage. If you have to spend that same time caring for some patients (some of which may be terminally ill), I'd bet that you'd be carrying home some emotional baggage after every shift.

[Lsos]

Hahahahaha! I'm just a little paranoid. Let's just say high school years were hell for me and some of that is still with me. I am contemplating nursing as well which is another problem. I don't know which one to choose.

From my experience, high school and college are night/ day difference. People seem to be more liberal and accepting in college...or they basically don't care as much.

Because of this, alot of...um, "interesting" people come out of the closet in college...crazy colored hairstyles, vampire people, etc. Some of them would make Lady Gaga blush. If they can handle it, being a woman engineer should be a walk in the park.

That, and quite honeslty you probably WILL be one of a small percentage of girls in the school. Just becasue of that fact you should ideally receive more positive attention than otherwise.

I didn't have many women in my engineering classes. One...maybe two. But I don't recall her being harassed. One of my engineering professors was also a woman...

[blade123]

If the threat of sexism worries you, it worries you and there's nothing you can do about it. However, although you can't control how you feel, you can control how you ACT. Don't let your transient emotions deter you from entering a degree that you'd enjoy.


Just like a woman, getting all emotional over nothing...


Kidding, of course... :p

[mege]

My mother is a civil engineer. Because of the job market flux, near Detroit, she is doing road/bridge construction inspection to bide time until retirement - but she never has any issues with the guys. It may be different because she has 30 years experience and knows enough people, but she's succeeded across all that time.

I think you may have more of an issue with nursing because of the heirarchy that is everpresent in nursing with MDs above and MAs below. While a male Doctor may not mean to offend your gender, the role in which you are taking as a nurse may cause more 'incident'. Also, patients may be more demeaning than perpetual, professional coworkers in an engineering environment.

Of course you should do what feels right, but if you're to the point of flipping a coin over it, I would suggest going the engineering route.

[Tosh5457]

I thought this topic would be about a guy who wanted to become a "female engineering" student :rofl:

[n1person]

I think to some extent there is a degree of reverse sexism and affirmative action towards females in engineering. When applying for a program (or a job) in Engineering or other STEM fields, diversity is desired, so often times if all other things being equal, the female will have a slight edge in getting into the program or job. Obviously this effect is rather small and getting smaller every year as more females are going into STEM fields.

[morninglover1]

sexist comments no. its not like we're in the 60s..
my mom is a chemical engineer..i never knew how difficult it was until i got into college. of course being engineer for me, aint gonna happen as i am too dumb.

i was in an assembly class once and i was the only female there. i had to drop the class. not for any reason but the teacher didnt want me there as it wasnt part of my prospectus (i really wanted to join though i was interested in it).

as for asking whats better engineering or nursing. are you kidding ..

im a nurse, and it really depends if youre "made" for this. this is a lot of work..and i mean labor intensive. graveyard shifts, etc.

i need to warn you of the people you need to work with, they are like no other. it makes me mad just thinking about it. everyone is snappy. the whole environment is toxic.

the pay is just the same. look it up. engineers sit there and do stuff and get paid the same..and nurses need to clean bedpans, mucus, be elbow deep in blood, secretions..one mistake and you can get fired. i was in deep trouble for writing on the wrong chart. and i mean deep sh$%..


money isnt everything. if i had the brains i'd be an engineer instead :)