ID bullets with metal compounds

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of creating unique metal compositions for every bullet produced, with a focus on the implications for identification and law enforcement. Participants explore the practicality, costs, and potential effectiveness of such a system in real-world scenarios.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the feasibility of producing a unique metal composition for every bullet, citing the scale of production (billions of bullets).
  • Another participant suggests that while the idea is good, it may not be practical due to existing methods used by bullet manufacturers to track batches of ammunition.
  • Some participants argue that the proposed method would be inefficient and expensive compared to current practices.
  • Concerns are raised about the real-world utility of tracking individual bullets, with one participant asserting that existing tracking methods are sufficient for law enforcement.
  • There is a discussion about the challenges of cataloging the metallurgical composition of each bullet if unique compositions were to be produced.
  • One participant compares the proposed method to DNA testing, suggesting that while testing might be straightforward, the manufacturing process would be impractical on a commercial scale.
  • A later reply notes the lack of a manufacturing process that can create unique compositions akin to biological uniqueness.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the practicality and necessity of creating unique bullet compositions. There is no consensus on whether the proposed method would be effective or feasible in real-world applications.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the existing practices of bullet manufacturers and the potential inefficiencies of tracking individual bullets. The discussion highlights the complexity of manufacturing processes and the implications for law enforcement without resolving these issues.

Pengwuino
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Ok i got into an argument about the feasibility of this idea. For every bullet ever made from now on, put a metal composition inside of it that is unique to every single bullet produced.

0.09864 moles/g MgS
0.00787 moles/g Ca2S
0.01535 moles/g Cu4Zn3
0.06772 moles/g Ti5Cd2

Bullet cases sold at Wal-Mart in Charleston, West Virginia to Richard Hammonds on 9/12/06.

Was the example "ID". Is this at all possible? Also what was included in the argument is how this would stand up in the real world after being actually fired from a barrel and after hitting a target. Also, for anyoen who has an answer... what are your credentials if you don't mind.
 
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Good idea, but don't try to patent it- the trace elements that get mixed in
by chance are already being used to do this.

Bullet makers keep archives of their melts for law enforcement to do this
very thing.
 
Antiphon said:
Good idea, but don't try to patent it- the trace elements that get mixed in
by chance are already being used to do this.

Bullet makers keep archives of their melts for law enforcement to do this
very thing.
Caveat - they would do that by batch. To do it by bullet would be very inefficient, I would think.
 
A melt is an industrial term for a molten batch. (At least it is in the glass business.)
Maybe it's called a "pour" in the metals world.
 
But coudl you create a separate combonation for every single bullet you make (every bullet... billion+, not just every model) in mass productino?
 
You could but it would be expensive and unnecessary.
 
How expensive and how unnecessary on say, a $.05 bullet. WOuld it have any real use in the real world to help stop crime/prosecute people easier?
 
It won't make it any easier than it already is.

If you tell me that 1000 boxes of ammo were sold with the same lead
and 5 of those boxes were sold in my neighborhood, and I have a receipt for
one of those 5 boxes and they pluck one of those bullets out of a terrorists's
head, you can bet your bottom dollar it came out of my gun. You don't need
to track each bullet to figure that out.
 
Antiphon said:
It won't make it any easier than it already is.

If you tell me that 1000 boxes of ammo were sold with the same lead
and 5 of those boxes were sold in my neighborhood, and I have a receipt for
one of those 5 boxes and they pluck one of those bullets out of a terrorists's
head, you can bet your bottom dollar it came out of my gun. You don't need
to track each bullet to figure that out.

Besides, it would be a manufacturing nightmare to even produce unique bullets, let alone try to catalogue the metallurgical composition of each individual bullet.
 
  • #10
brewnog said:
Besides, it would be a manufacturing nightmare to even produce unique bullets, let alone try to catalogue the metallurgical composition of each individual bullet.

Well this guy i know seems to think it would be easy and wouldn't cost much at all and think its akin to DNA testing.
 
  • #11
Pengwuino said:
Well this guy i know seems to think it would be easy and wouldn't cost much at all and think its akin to DNA testing.


Testing would be easy, since you'd only have to do it when there's been a murder. Actually making each bullet from a different alloy would be impossible to do on a commercial basis.
 
  • #12
Yes but unfortunately we don't know anything that manufactors like the human body does in its uniqueness (sp?)