Intersecting circles in 2D: find some coordinates

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the coordinates of a point D on the intersection of two circles in a 2D space, given specific points and angles related to those circles. The original poster presents a scenario involving circles O1 and O2, with points A, B, C, and D, and seeks to determine the coordinates of D using limited information.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the implications of the given points and angles, questioning whether the information provided is sufficient to determine point D. Some suggest that the geometry of the situation may allow for varying positions of D without a unique solution.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants offering different perspectives on the problem's constraints and the geometry involved. Some guidance is provided regarding the setup of equations for the circles, but there is no consensus on the feasibility of finding point D given the stated conditions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the fixed positions of points A, B, and C, as well as the angles ADC and BDA, which are critical to the geometry of the problem. There is an acknowledgment of potential limitations in the information provided for solving the problem.

Emieno
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I have two circles intersecting at 2 points in 2d space. Let's call them cirles O1 and O2. On O1, I have 3 points A,B and D. On O2, I have a point C.
Given co-ords of only 3 points A, B, C, and value of angle ADC (alpha), how can I find out the coord values x,y of point D ?
Thanks :blushing:
 
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oOooo, I forgot to say, the two points at which the two circles intersect are A and D.
 
You can't do it. Not enough info.

Let the circle with A,C and D be fixed - in size.
Let the circle through A and B now vary in size such that the point of intersection of the circles is D.
The point D will vary in position, but still be a point somewhere on the circumference.
But by simple geometry, the angle ADC is constant regardlees of the position of D.
In other words, with AB and C fixed in positoin and with angle ADC fixed in size, I have been able to vary the postion of D - ergo no solution
 
Oh sorry, another detail I forgot to say is angle BDA=beta
In sum, A,D,C are on O1, B is on O2, O1 cut O2= {A,D} , BDA=beta, ADC=alpha, A(a1,a2), C(c1,c2),B(b1,b2) and D is what I have to find.
 
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There's a little bit of geometry involved at first, then the rest is just a lot of trig.

Here's the Strategy
Take one of the circles.
We define a third point on that circle.
Then we set up the eqn for that circle: (x-g)² + (y-h)² = R², where (g,h) are the coords of the centre-point of that circle.
We set up the eqn for the 2nd circle.
Find out where the circles intersect.
A(a1,a2) will be one solution. D(d1,d2) will be the other solution.

The Geometry bit
Take any circle. Let P and Q be two points on it. PQ is a chord of that circle. Let R be any other point on the circle. The angle PRQ is the angle subtended by the chord PQ. Now there is a geometry theorem, which I can't for the life of me remember the name of, but it means that wherever R is on the circle, then the angle PRQ is always the same. Here endeth the geometry lesson.

The applied geometry bit
Let C1 be the circle, with centre O1, containing the points A, B and D. AB is a chord of that circle. The angle ADB is beta. Now draw a line from A through the centre-point, O1, meeting the circle at the point E, say. Then the line AE is a diameter of the circle, and by the geometry theorem just mentioned, angle AEB, on the chord AB is equal to the angle ADB, also on the chord AB. Also, since AE is a diameter, then angle ABE is a right angle.

The trig bit
The rest is now just a lot of trig, to finish off the Strategy.

Can you work out from this, the eqn of the circle defining the circle C1?
 
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