Michael Moore's letter to George W. Bush

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around Michael Moore's letter to George W. Bush, exploring themes of political expression, public sentiment, and the impact of media on societal issues. Participants express varying opinions on Moore's character, the effectiveness of his message, and the broader implications of his views on war and politics.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants appreciate Moore's frankness but question the effectiveness of his tone, suggesting it could be "seasoned with salt."
  • Others express strong disapproval of Moore, labeling him as a "psycho" and criticizing his intentions and the quality of his work.
  • A few participants argue that Moore's letter serves more as a publicity stunt than a serious political statement, doubting its impact on Bush or his advisors.
  • Some express skepticism about the public's support for the war and Bush's leadership, suggesting that the complexities of war are not adequately addressed in Moore's arguments.
  • There are references to the emotional and psychological effects of war, with some participants noting the protests against it globally.
  • Several participants draw comparisons between Moore and other controversial figures, suggesting that both seek attention for personal gain.
  • One participant critiques Moore's historical understanding, arguing that his statements lack context regarding the nature of dictatorships and their consequences.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the merits of Moore's letter and his character, with no consensus on whether his approach is justified or effective. Views on the political context and implications of his message are also contested.

Contextual Notes

Some arguments rely on assumptions about public sentiment and the motivations of political figures, which remain unexamined. The discussion includes references to specific historical events and figures, but these are not universally accepted as relevant or accurate by all participants.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in political discourse, media influence on public opinion, and the dynamics of controversial figures in politics may find this discussion relevant.

Manuel_Silvio
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You know, Michael Moore won an Academy Award for his documentary film, "Bowling for Columbine" (I haven't seen the film).

See his letter to George W. Bush at:

http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15406

I'm not so much agreed to his US-centered view but like what he's so frank and straight said in the face of a politician who, like other politicians, will turn out to have been a major factor in homo sapiens inevitable soon-to-happen extinction in near future.
 
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He speaks with a lot of rage. He makes a lot of good points, but I think they would be better appreciated if "seasoned with salt".
 
*deleted because of Physics Forums Guideline violations*
Live long and prosper (most of you... ).
 
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thank you for sharing, i enjoyed the letter...
 
I like the letter to.
 
Originally posted by drag
Someone should blow this phsyco's house or car
in his face and see if maybe that can fix his
apparently badly damaged brain-wave patterns.

Live long and prosper (most of you... ).

So you disagree with this "psycho"?
 
Interesting, but I personally think most of the members here could write a better and more convicing letter. I don't like michael moore as a start, his phoney movie and his little oscar prank was lame.
 
Originally posted by Greg Bernhardt
Interesting, but I personally think most of the members here could write a better and more convicing letter.

Well thank you (on behalf of those members you were actually referring to):smile: .
 
It it was a publicity stunt for Michael Moore's huge self-righteous ego. I'd bet that no one even close to bush has read that letter.
 
  • #10
i have never been a fan of Michael Moore but personally i think his intentions are honorable, although is actions do leave much to be desired. as for Bush reading the letter; i'll bet no one close to Bush even wants him to see it, and i doubt the man sees much aside from what his advisers put in his face.
 
  • #11
Originally posted by Mentat
So you disagree with this "psycho"?
Disagree ? With what ?
To disagree I need to hear something that
makes sense. This guy is just full of sh*t
and he's playing it like a dirty entertainer
because the more attention such people
manage to get the more they're worth.
Look at Monica - "poor" girl's really working
hard - crying at every lecture. Who wouldn't, if
it makes your bank account swell so much.

Live long and prosper.
 
  • #12
Originally posted by drag
Who wouldn't, if
it makes your bank account swell so much.

well people who do not really care about making their back account swell, duh!
 
  • #13
I think I just might be stupider now having read that then before I did so. Michael Moore is a money driven physco who wouldn't recognize truth if it hit him over the head. I think perhaps a line from Adam Sandlers classic "Billy Madison" best sums up what I like to tell him if I ever had the unfortunate chance of meeting him.
Mr. [Moore], what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Man that was a good movie!
 
  • #14
but the guy who said that got his ass kicked!
 
  • #15
Originally posted by Greg Bernhardt
I don't like michael moore as a start, his phoney movie and his little oscar prank was lame.
Agreed on all of those.
 
  • #16
Originally posted by kyleb
but the guy who said that got his ass kicked!

The principal? No he didn't. At least not that I remember, am I forgetting something. I though Billy's reply to it was just looking up with a shamed look and saying "A simple no would've worked just fine." I don't remember him beating him up or anything.
 
  • #17
Originally posted by drag
Disagree ? With what ?
To disagree I need to hear something that
makes sense. This guy is just full of sh*t
and he's playing it like a dirty entertainer
because the more attention such people
manage to get the more they're worth.
Look at Monica - "poor" girl's really working
hard - crying at every lecture. Who wouldn't, if
it makes your bank account swell so much.

Live long and prosper.

Well... opinions obviously differ. :wink: Needless to say he is a contraversial figure.
 
  • #18
ah, fair enough climbhi; i was thinking of the seen with the science teacher.
 
  • #19
That was actually very stupid. Isn't the public support for the President and the war over 50%? Not 51% either, a considerable amount over it.

Another point people often use against Bush is he isn't fighting in the war. You must have someone leading the war, and leading the country at all times, wouldn't make sense to have the man leading our country in Iraq fighting a war. And joining the Army has, since the draft, been a free choice, the men and woman that join know there is a chance of a war, and therefore, a chance to go to the war and perhaps give you life, that is the risk of the job, they chose it, I respect their decisions, and I would join the Army too if I could. Anyways, Michael Moore is an idiot
 
  • #20
Originally posted by Greg Bernhardt
Interesting, but I personally think most of the members here could write a better and more convicing letter. I don't like michael moore as a start, his phoney movie and his little oscar prank was lame.
So? He's the liberal version of Rush Limbaugh, I guess...except he lies a lot less.
 
  • #21
GWB will never see that letter, but I bet it made Michael feel better to write it. Millions worldwide protested, and continue to protest, in Europe, Asia, North America, Africa, and the Middle East. Soon we'll be asking Wolfowitz, "So what now?"
The US has underestimated the enemy, and underestimated the psychological effect of so many dead, and so much destruction. We'll be in Iraq for a long time, at least until the oil is gone.
 
  • #22
Here's one in Johannesberg:
http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20030405/capt.sge.sih80.050403231527.photo00.default-322x334.jpg

And one from Turkey:

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20030406/capt.1049637211.turkey_antiwar_iraq_war_ist101.jpg

Note the dead baby on the grim reaper's scithe.
 
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  • #23
Originally posted by kyle_soule
Another point people often use against Bush is he isn't fighting in the war. You must have someone leading the war, and leading the country at all times, wouldn't make sense to have the man leading our country in Iraq fighting a war.
What are you saying - that he's NOT a 100% cowboy?!
 
  • #24
The guy is a moron. His writing is childish. His opinions are unsubstantiated and presented as facts, such statements as, (Quote from Mr. Moore's letter...)"Walk out of the White House and on to any street in America and try to find five people who are passionate about wanting to kill Iraqis." are incomplete at very least. Ask those same five people if they want to put an end to the regime of an evil man (Hussien) who has "killed more Iraqis than anyone else in the world" (paraphrased from Donald Rumsfeld, I think it was him, during a news conference last week) and see what the answer is.

Does he know nothing about history? Hussien has been compared, and justifiably so, to Hitler. If you let a dictator grow in power he will not just go away or leave you alone.
 
  • #25
Originally posted by Greg Bernhardt
Interesting, but I personally think most of the members here could write a better and more convicing letter. I don't like michael moore as a start, his phoney movie and his little oscar prank was lame.
Agreed (Artman too). There wasn nothing particularly compelling about that letter.

To me this guy is just another hippie searching for a cause. I was going to watch his movie becaue so many people are talking about it, but now I see there is no point.

So? He's the liberal version of Rush Limbaugh, I guess...except he lies a lot less.
Less? I'm no fan of Rush Limbaugh, he's pompus and arrogant, but did you even READ the letter Zero? If anything he avoids lying by simply not dealing with facts.
 
  • #26
Originally posted by russ_watters


Less? I'm no fan of Rush Limbaugh, he's pompus and arrogant, but did you even READ the letter Zero? If anything he avoids lying by simply not dealing with facts.

I am speaking generally. I have read books by both men, and Rush simply creates whatever suits his fantasies about things like 'liberal media' and 'liberals' in general. Moore at least has some facts on his side(although he interprets them for maximum entertainment value). You should read his 'Clinton bashing', before you completely condemn the man.
 
  • #27
Originally posted by Artman
The guy is a moron. His writing is childish. His opinions are unsubstantiated and presented as facts...

Ok, enough about Bush, we are talking about Moore here.
 
  • #28
Ok, enough about Bush, we are talking about Moore here.

I guess I need to be more specific in my comments.

As I read the Moore letter, I kept thinking, "Where is your (Moore) proof for this, where are your (Moore) examples? Cite the lies that you claim he (Bush) has been telling."

You should read his 'Clinton bashing', before you completely condemn the man.

Ok, if he bashed Clinton, I retract my moron statement. He can't be all bad.

Moore's writing is still not well supported with facts in the letter. The whole thing had a grade school feel to me.
 
  • #29
Yreah, but still...he's a movie maker and entertainer, not a reporter. Two different standards...
 
  • #30
Artman, it was never intended to be supported with facts in the letter; the facts are all around and the letter was just pointing to them.
 

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