How do you deal with crackpots?

Evo

Then one could say what's the harm with psychic healing. Where do you draw the line when it comes to believing in nonsense?

If a person believes that death is just the door to a better, happier life, then why take precautions to stay in this one? And I've never heard a single person that "talks to the dead" report that Aunt Martha is in hell, or that their loved ones are in agony. They're always happier now and in a better place.

micromass

For me the danger is not so much what the people believe. If somebody wants to believe something crazy then they're free to. It becomes dangerous when they're starting to tell other people what to do.

For example, if somebody has the notion that blood transfusions are a sin and will rather let their child die instead of giving them blood. That's dangerous.

Or when people want to force their pet belief system into education. That's dangerous.

Or if somebody found a new system to beat the casino and wastes all the money of their family. That's dangerous.

These things happen all the time. It is pure crackpottery gone bad. People can be crackpots all they want. But they shouldn't start forcing their beliefs on others.

chrisbaird

To add to the comment by micromass, many crackpotteries are tied to pyramid marketing schemes, so the participants have a perceived financial interest in forcing their crackpottery on others. This can do a lot of damage to relationships among family and friends. To protect relationships, my spouse and I decided to set a ground rule: we never buy anything directly from a friend or family member or entertain any sales pitches from people we care about.

Ivan Seeking

When it starts to do significant harm. As I said, inductive reasoning can only be taken so far.

Evo

I have to admit I enjoyed reading and watching shows about the supernatural and the unexplained before I joined PF. But to be honest, I think it's the ridiculously over the top reality tv shows that have killed it for me. Who can watch that garbage?

Ivan Seeking

So then the beliefs aren't the problem. Rather it is the imposition of those beliefs on others. I think we have a Constitution to handle that.

So should we assume that all of those people playing slot machines think they have a system? Of course not. People gamble all the time and the notion of a secret system has nothing to do with it. It is an addiction. It is a disease.

Ivan Seeking

We were talking about the idea of beliefs in isolation. When it comes to arenas like national politics, these false beliefs can be and should be, and you can bet, will be exposed.

Ivan Seeking

I know. When I was moderating this forum there were times I thought my head would explode.

But I do have to step back and wonder where we draw the line. This entire point was really driven home for me recently with my mildly retarded uncle. He believes all sorts of nonsense because he is so vulnerable intellectually. But over the years it has become clear that one should only intervene so much. Beyond those times when his beliefs are self destructive, he is best to believe what he wants. That may be about the only happiness he has in life.

But I have also seen example after example over the years suggesting that most people believe weird things because they need to. As MacLaddy mentioned, it gives them something to live for.

Consider this: If you convince someone that there is no heaven, for them, you just stole their eternal salvation and everlasting life. If we die and that's it, they never would have known they were wrong.

micromass

After a while, every crackpot idea starts to do harm in some way. It's important to fight it in its roots.

micromass

The constitution alone cannot handle such things. Creationism was almost teached in schools!! And it might happen again.

Here, we have teachers trying to teach evolution to kids. And some of the kids were told by their parents to disrupt class and to not let the teacher talk. The other kids are harmed in this process. Consitution does not help in this cases.

Crackpottery is a disease. It's like a gambling addiction. I don't think the two are very two apart.

Pengwuino

That's the point, beliefs don't happen in isolation. In fact, that was the point of the thread; what happens when pseudoscience walks into the forum? If every psychic, paranormal, witchcraft believing person could be isolated on an island, never to bother the rest of us, then that would be great! Unfortunately, that's not how the world works.

micromass

That's only part of the issue. If you people convince that their is no hell, then you saved them from fear. You saved them from the horrible thoughts that their family and friends will go to hell. The people might as well be relieved that they don't belief in it anymore.

Evo

I always wished we had the ability to lock all of the crackpots in one sub-forum where they could only talk to other crackpots. I think that would be hilarious to watch. Oh wait, we have the philosophy forum...

(runs and hides)

micromass

Yes, especially if we'd force Evo to moderate it.

Evo

You were too quick, I added to the post, I thought you'd get a kick out of it.

micromass

Evo is funny as always!!

Ryan_m_b

That was a big point I was making, no one lives in isolation. Beliefs determine actions, actions affect others. Whether it's at a national political level or just when chatting over a pint.