Rick Santorum's candidacy ...

Number Nine

This is actually an extremely important point. Religious devotion has led to the idiom of sorts that a person who pursues something zealously is pursuing it "religiously", but this doesn't mean that the term "religion" actually applies to that pursuit.

jreelawg

I don't think it is necessary to equate Santorums views with religion, although his religious beliefs certainly contribute to them.

For example, Santorum thinks that colleges are controlled by Satan. Where in the bible is it written that colleges are or would be controlled by Satan? This is his theory, which he puts into the context of his religious perspective, but is his own idea, not an idea which is represented by his religion.

Now there are plenty of people of the same religion, with very different views.

When he says though, that he thinks colleges are controlled by Satan, I take it that he hates colleges the same way that many U.S. churches used to say god hates black people.

I think some disturbed people incorporate there own views, dislikes, hatred, or whatever, into their religion. Then you end up with this addition to a religion being passed down as children learn from their parents etc.

The next thing you know, the religious tone has evolved in meaning according to some lunatics popularized hatred.

So when I look at Santorum, I don't really see him in terms of his religion so much as his character. I think he's just an angry little man.

Hobin

He's a little too popular for someone's who's just an angry little man, methinks.

lisab

Maybe "angry little man" is the Zeitgeist for the great recession.

Pythagorean

thus my lack of reply :)

Office_Shredder

http://m.cbsnews.com/blogsfullstory....6&videofeed=36

No country that had ever form socialized medicine has stopped using it, and santorum states that this is a negative feature

mheslep

I admit that it is difficult to give up, but I'm not sure about the no country claim. I thought the Dutch gave it up? Others have backed away at least a degree or two. The Canadians for instance used to outlaw private clinics in some provinces, but that law was since ruled illegal.

edit: yes

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp0707383

Anybody know of other cases?

MarcoD

No, we definitely didn't. Some things changed/were liberalized, people were hoping that market effects would lower some of the involved costs. I don't think it did, but like I said, we have such an baroque system that only experts understand how it works.

mheslep

Can you square that with the New England Journal of Medicine reference? Sounds like you may be referring to the stipend given to the poor

But that's nothing close to the system in place before 2006 which was .... public healthcare

MarcoD

No, I am referring to the whole system where the government is very active in what healthcare should be provided/be mandatory, how the insurers buy medical care, what guidelines there are for all actors, etc. It surely isn't a free market mechanism, and it's only understood by the actors.

Personally, I think it's just all overhead on a process where you don't want any market mechanism; i.e., neoliberal nonsense. I have the feeling that the whole system works at the moment despite the nonsense because most people in the field try their best to make it work no matter what. But that's just my unfounded opinion, and I guess it's a discussion I shouldn't even be involved in.

Anyway, cost are exploding. That's all I know.

ThomasT

It would seem to be for, say, the OWS people.

ThomasT

Ok, so I guess we're all agreed that, wrt this thread, the term religion refers to the big three theistic religions, Islam, Judaism, and Christianity? And of course I realize that that's generally how the term is used in ordinary language. But, like I said, it does have other meanings which have been used in arguments by religious (in the ordinary sense) zealots.

Anyway, in the agreed, and ordinary, sense, Santorum is, to me, an unnacceptably religious person. And for that reason, I will not vote for him.

ThomasT

I agree with you in the sense that as far as I'm concerned he's too popular. But I don't see him as an angry little man. After all, he's rich, he's running for president, he's got a nice family. What's he got to be angry about? He'd probably make a great neighbor. I just don't want him to be president -- mostly because of the fact that he seems to be a bit too theistically religious for my ... sensibilities.

mheslep

Ok, the Dutch have regulated healthcare by private insurers in a market. They use to have public insurance for 2/3 of the country, i.e. socialized healthcare, now they don't. I think that's a counter-example to Santorum's claim.

Gokul43201

And there's plenty of counter examples to his second statement as well, that no country that's lost its freedom has ever regained it. Why would he even want to say something like that? It's all over folks - we've socialized medicine and lost our freedom, and there's no turning back. Might as well retire to your bunkers and wait for the apocalypse.

lisab

The ratcheting down of freedom.

That made me laugh .

SHISHKABOB

he'd make a great neighbor

as long as you don't forget your front yard nativity scene dun dun dun