
#1
Jan913, 10:18 AM

P: 59

i want to compare force on current carrying conductor ,
1)placed in air surrounded by magnetic field 2)placed in the cylindrical cavity(without air gap but some electrical insulation) which is placed in magnetic field. please give me practically calculated answers with calculations. 



#2
Jan913, 04:15 PM

Mentor
P: 39,720

http://hyperphysics.phyastr.gsu.edu...c/forwir2.html And for your case #2, could you maybe clarify a bit about the geometry? Is there some application that you have in mind? I think I know the answer, but need a few more details before commenting about the force for case #2... 



#3
Jan913, 10:54 PM

P: 59





#4
Jan1013, 12:08 AM

Mentor
P: 39,720

force on conductor carrying currentsurrounded by solid magnetic materialWhat is the context of your question? Is it a thought experiment, something for schoolwork, or somthing that you want to build and test? 



#5
Jan1113, 07:58 AM

P: 59

i want to build & test it.
can you provide mathematical or logical explanation for your answer ? take sketch as there are 2 poles of magnet separated by a distance.in between them space is filled by magnetic material . it contains cavity having conductor carrying current. can you give me the formula and practical answer for above scenario? what are values of relative permeabilities for magnetic materials? 



#6
Jan1113, 12:42 PM

Mentor
P: 39,720

The cavity in the magnetic material is shielded from the external Bfield. That's what magnetic materials do  they concentrate and divert magnetic fields. So the wire in the cavity will experience very little or zero magnetic field, and there will be a correspondingly small force on it. 



#7
Jan1113, 01:19 PM

P: 11

My new electric motor is based on exactly this thing (part of the coil is in the cavity of a permalloy).
http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=663657 



#8
Jan1113, 01:26 PM

Mentor
P: 39,720

But if you have permalloy surrounding some of your wires, they will not have much force applied to them because of the shielding effect. 



#9
Jan1113, 03:12 PM

P: 11

That's the key. On a certain portion there must be no electromagnetic force, else the integral of force on the entire coil would be 0. No matter how you place the magnet or the coil, without such shielding or without current switching (with an electronic speed controller or brushes), there can't be any continuous rotation which is required in an electric motor. 



#10
Jan1213, 03:04 AM

P: 59

so, in which material medium the force on current carrying conductor will be highest?
(consider above configuration) 


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