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Infinity minus Infinity

by Holocene
Tags: infinity, minus
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Holocene
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Mar25-07, 03:48 PM
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Does subtracting infinity from infinity leave you with zero?

Or could you subtract infinity from infinity and still have infinity?
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Werg22
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Mar25-07, 03:52 PM
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Subtracting infinity from infinity has no mathematical meaning. Unless we are talking about limits and orders of magnitude.
JasonRox
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Mar25-07, 04:00 PM
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Quote Quote by Werg22 View Post
Subtracting infinity from infinity has no mathematical meaning. Unless we are talking about limits and orders of magnitude.
You can't subtract but you can add infinity from infinity.

Let N be the natural numbers and R be the real numbers. And card(X) denote the cardinality of X.

card(R) + card(N) = card(R)
card(N) + card(N) = card(N)

Hurkyl
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Mar25-07, 04:14 PM
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Infinity minus Infinity

Quote Quote by Holocene View Post
Does subtracting infinity from infinity leave you with zero?

Or could you subtract infinity from infinity and still have infinity?
What "infinity" are you talking about? What notion of subtraction are you talking about? Your question really cannot be answered unless these are specified. (Though we can guess at what you meant, in order to give an answer)

Some examples:
The extended real line contains two points "at infinity": [itex]+\infty[/itex] and [itex]-\infty[/itex]. The extended real line also comes with a notion of subtraction that's defined for most, but not all arguments. [itex](+\infty) - (-\infty) = +\infty[/itex] and [itex](-\infty) - (+\infty) = -\infty[/itex], but [itex](+\infty) - (+\infty)[/itex] and [itex](-\infty) - (-\infty)[/itex] are undefined. (And any combination involving at least one finite number is defined)

In the cardinal numbers, there are lots of infinite cardinals. (literally, too many to count) Subtraction makes little sense for them, because if [itex]\alpha \leq \beta[/itex] and [itex]\beta[/itex] is infinite, then [itex]\alpha + \beta = \beta[/itex].

The hyperreal line contains many infinite and infinitessimal numbers, and in a certain sense, the hyperreals behave exactly like the reals. (e.g. you can subtract any hyperreal from any other hyperreal)
HallsofIvy
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Mar25-07, 06:36 PM
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Quote Quote by JasonRox View Post
You can't subtract but you can add infinity from infinity.

Let N be the natural numbers and R be the real numbers. And card(X) denote the cardinality of X.

card(R) + card(N) = card(R)
card(N) + card(N) = card(N)
But, in order to do that, you have to be talking about "cardinal numbers", not the regular real numbers- which I'm pretty sure is what the OP was talking about. "Infinity", in any sense, is not a real number and so neither addition nor subtraction (nor, for that matter multiplication or division) is defined for "infinity".


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