Revolutions and Prosperity

rootX

Do revolutions lead to prosperity?

or

Do we need revolutions for prosperity?

or

Is revolutions one of the factors that determine prosperity?

defⁿ
Revolutions : Overthrowing the governments
Prosperity : Good living standards e.g. literacy and life expectancy.

Scope:
Only last 500 years

I have been thinking of this question for more than a month. I am still not confident about what is the right question to ask and how we can answer the right question.

It might also be a good idea if we limit ourselves to last 500 years so we do not consider anything that happened before that. Otherwise, countries have come up and down through out the history so it might be meaningless to look at last thousand years to answer this question.

I thought about going back and finding all revolutions that happened in the past and finding if revolutions brought better living standards and comparing it to possibility if the revolution did not occur. Other way will be comparing two similar countries: one that overthrew its government and one that did not.

Please refrain from unsubstantiated personal opinions or propaganda.

Unfortunately, currently I do not have sufficient time to study this myself so I thought I would put here.

BWV

I think you can state categorically that every communist revolution in the 20th century resulted in a lower overall standard of living, if only for the ubiquity of large famines

the issue would hinge on the existing institutions (legal system, property rights, civil discourse etc) and whether they were preserved or not. The US had the common law system to fall back on and the UK which they revolted against was the among the most liberal political systems in existence during that time, so things really did not change that much. In contrast, Spanish colonialism was much more brutal and repressive and there were not stable civil institutions for Latin America to fall back on.

Egypt has better institutions than Libya where Quadafi ran a totalitarian regime - which bodes better for Egypt

talk2glenn

Generally speaking, violent revolution does not end well.

http://www.newsweek.com/2011/02/27/u...volutions.html

russ_watters

Is the question even relevant? The question implies to me that revolutions are about an attempt to increase prosperity. What if they have nothing to do with prosperity - is it a relevant question?

talk2glenn

In fairness to the OP, I think in political science economic hardship is considered a sufficient condition for revolution. Whatever the ostensible motivations, generally, poor people rebel and wealthy people don't.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Anatomy_of_Revolution

I read the question as, "do they make those poor people any better off?" The answer is, usually not.

WhoWee

Is it possible that Entitlement programs (expanded in the 1960's) in the US have given a false sense of prosperity to millions of beneficiaries?

nismaratwork

The Egyptians seemed to think so.

nismaratwork

I wouldn't confuse a safety net with prosperity.

WhoWee

Unemployment is a safety net - lifelong participation in food, housing and medical is not (IMO).

nismaratwork

It sure as hell isn't anything a reasonable person would call prosperity either. I'm not arguing against abuses in these systems; they are MEANT to be safety nets.

WhoWee

Let's think about that a minute. In the 1960's, the expansion of welfare was a dream come true to many - now - it seems it isn't good enough "to a reasonable person"??? My turn to laugh (sorry).

nismaratwork

Not what I said: it isn't "PROSPERITY."

edit: Welfare is not that, unless you're engaged in MASSIVE fraud.

WhoWee

If you recall, this started when I said "Is it possible that Entitlement programs (expanded in the 1960's) in the US have given a false sense of prosperity to millions of beneficiaries?" my bold

nismaratwork

...I don't see how the dole queue gives a false sense of Prosperity unless the word is to be butchered.

WhoWee

If a family receives $500 per month in food, $400 in rent subsidy, $1,500 in medical, $100 in transportation, $300 in utility subsidy, and $900 SSDI - total $3,700 per month = $44,000 per year PLUS EIC (if someone worked a few hour - maybe $1,000 per year?) of perhaps $5,000= $50,000 gross @ 20 years equals $1,000,000 - isn't it like winning the lottery?

nismaratwork

1 million USD for a family over 20 years, at the most? No, and I'm not arguing for or against it, but no matter how you flip it, that's still not prosperity.

WhoWee

I said "false sense of prosperity" - IMO - the nation is starting to wake up and pay attention. Again IMO, if there's a "revolution" this time - it's going to be by the taxpayers and non-union people who are tired of hearing how bad unions and people on welfare have it - and aren't buying the line that only the "rich" people need to pay - again IMO.