Unravelling the Mystery of logn Identities

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation and understanding of two logarithmic identities: (logn)^{logn} = n^{log(logn)} and (logn)^{log(logn)} = e^{(log(logn))^2}. Participants explore the mathematical reasoning behind these identities and the implications of using different logarithmic bases.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the origins of the identities involving logarithms.
  • Another participant proposes a step-by-step derivation of the first identity, showing how log(n) raised to log(n) can be transformed into n raised to log(log(n)).
  • A third participant emphasizes the importance of specifying the logarithm base, suggesting that using natural logarithm notation (ln) is clearer than using log, which can be ambiguous.
  • This participant also provides a similar derivation for both identities, illustrating the equivalence through manipulation of exponential and logarithmic forms.
  • A later reply expresses appreciation for the clarification provided, indicating a positive reception of the explanations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the identities' origins, but they engage in a constructive exploration of the mathematical reasoning involved. There is no explicit disagreement, but the discussion reflects varying levels of understanding and clarity regarding logarithmic notation.

Contextual Notes

There is a potential limitation regarding the interpretation of logarithmic bases, as participants note the ambiguity in using "log" without specification. This could affect the understanding of the identities presented.

quasar987
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I don't get where these two identities come from:

[tex](logn)^{logn} = n^{log(logn)}[/tex]

and

[tex](logn)^{log(logn)} = e^{(log(logn))^2}[/tex]
 
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I can only think of this roundabout way to show the first:

log(n)^log(n) = x
log(log(n)^log(n)) = log(x)
log(n) * log(log(n)) = log(x)
10^(log(n) * log(log(n))) = 10^log(x)
(10^log(n))^log(log(n)) = x
n^log(log(n)) = x

So log(n)^log(n) = n^log(log(n)).
 
If you're using the natural logarithm, its usually better to use [itex]\ln[/itex] or [itex]\log_e[/itex] rather than [itex]\log[/itex] which can be interpreted in other ways (for example as [itex]\log_{10}[/itex] or as a log with unspecified base) depending on context.

The identities are similar:

[tex]n^{\ln(\ln(n))}=\left(e^{\ln(n)}\right)^{\ln(\ln(n))}=e^{\ln(n) \times \ln(\ln(n))}=e^{\ln(\ln(n)) \times \ln(n)}=\left(e^{\ln(\ln(n))}\right)^{\ln(n)}=\left(\ln(n)\right)^{\ln(n)}[/tex]

[tex]e^{\left(\ln(\ln(n))\right)^2}=e^{\ln(\ln(n)) \times \ln(\ln(n))}=\left(e ^{\ln(\ln(n))}\right)^{\ln(\ln(n))}=\left(\ln(n)\right)^{\ln(\ln(n))}[/tex]
 
Oh, I see! Well thanks a bunch ! :smile:
 

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