Socialist EU finally Solves unemployment problem.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of Germany's welfare reforms and their impact on unemployment, particularly focusing on the controversial aspect of forcing individuals to accept jobs, including in the sex industry. Participants explore the intersection of socialism, traditional values, and government intervention in the labor market.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express strong opposition to socialism, linking it to Germany's unemployment issues and welfare reforms.
  • Others argue that the requirement for women to accept any available job, including prostitution, is a violation of personal rights and morality.
  • A few participants suggest that forcing individuals off welfare is necessary to prevent dependency, while also questioning the morality of specific job requirements.
  • There is a discussion about the definition and implications of "traditional values," with some asserting that it can be interpreted in various ways by different political groups.
  • Concerns are raised about the broader economic context of Germany, including its aging population and labor market regulations, which some participants argue are not purely socialist but indicative of structural issues.
  • Some participants challenge the notion that the reforms are socialist, suggesting that they reflect a misunderstanding of the term.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus; multiple competing views remain regarding the implications of the welfare reforms, the nature of socialism, and the morality of job requirements imposed by the government.

Contextual Notes

The discussion touches on complex socio-economic issues, including the integration of East and West Germany, labor market rigidities, and the varying interpretations of political ideologies. There are unresolved assumptions about the effectiveness and morality of the proposed solutions.

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Rather a typical red tape solution.
 
Wow, prostitution is legal...awesome.
 
Under Germany's welfare reforms, any woman under 55 who has been out of work for more than a year can be forced to take an available job – including in the sex industry – or lose her unemployment benefit

I HATE SOCIALISTS.

Its funny too. Because forcing people off of welfare is decidely unsocialist. IN fact, i love the idea. If they refuse to take a job, its their own damn fault. However, forcing them to be prostitutes through government action--thats why traditional values are good. Hear me, you flaming liberals??

Thats why traditional values are good. Because we're not them.
Or you.
 
Gotta love Germany. You're from LA, right franz? Did you ever listen to Dr. Drew and Adam Corolla play "Florida or Germany?"
 
loseyourname said:
Gotta love Germany. You're from LA, right franz? Did you ever listen to Dr. Drew and Adam Corolla play "Florida or Germany?"

Nope. Conservative in LA = KFI fan. But I'm curious as to this "Florida or Germany" concept.
 
franznietzsche said:
I HATE SOCIALISTS.

Its funny too. Because forcing people off of welfare is decidely unsocialist. IN fact, i love the idea. If they refuse to take a job, its their own damn fault. However, forcing them to be prostitutes through government action--thats why traditional values are good. Hear me, you flaming liberals??

Thats why traditional values are good. Because we're not them.
Or you.

It is needed to force people off welfare, otherwise they would stay on it for ever, - if someone would pay me lots for not going to work, they I would stay doing this for ever.
Prostitution should not be allowed however. It is legal in the USA though, not just parts of germany. The USA does not embrace the traditional values, as shown by its current lack of enslaving the blacks, and womens rights.
 
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franznietzsche said:
Nope. Conservative in LA = KFI fan. But I'm curious as to this "Florida or Germany" concept.

Yeah, I mostly listened to KFI when I wanted political talk, but Loveline was for kicks. "Florida or Germany" was based on the premise that all completely outrageous, bizarre sexual acts and crimes take place either in Germany or Florida. Drew and Adam would have people call in with strange stories of sexual perversion off of the news wires and someone on the show (either the hosts or a guest) would have to guess whether the events took place in Florida or Germany. They actually came to be fairly good at it after a while.
 
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Where do you come up with socialism?

World Factbook said:
Germany's affluent and technologically powerful economy- the fifth largest national economy in the world - has become one of the slowest growing economies in the entire euro zone, and a quick turnaround is not in the offing in the foreseeable future. Growth in 2001-03 fell short of 1%. The modernization and integration of the eastern German economy continues to be a costly long-term process, with annual transfers from west to east amounting to roughly $70 billion. Germany's ageing population, combined with high unemployment, has pushed social security outlays to a level exceeding contributions from workers. Structural rigidities in the labor market - including strict regulations on laying off workers and the setting of wages on a national basis - have made unemployment a chronic problem. Corporate restructuring and growing capital markets are setting the foundations that could allow Germany to meet the long-term challenges of European economic integration and globalization, particularly if labor market rigidities are further addressed. The government is also starting long-needed structural reforms designed to revitalize the country's economy. In the short run, however, the fall in government revenues and the rise in expenditures have raised the deficit above the EU's 3% debt limit.
Germany has a unique problem in that the East/West Germany integration is still in progress, otherwise their problems don't seem all that different from ours -

- Aging population with increasing Social Security obligations
- High minimum wages
- Strict regulations for laying off workers, plus unemployment compensation

If you're calling them socialist, then ... :rolleyes: oh, I see what you're getting at, now.
 
  • #10
plus said:
It is needed to force people off welfare, otherwise they would stay on it for ever, - if someone would pay me lots for not going to work, they I would stay doing this for ever.
Prostitution should not be allowed however. It is legal in the USA though, not just parts of germany. The USA does not embrace the traditional values, as shown by its current lack of enslaving the blacks, and womens rights.

Um, i think you misunderstand the use of the term "traditional values" but whatever. Otherwise you just agreed with everything i said.

I have nothing against the legalization of prostitution, i really don't care about that. Its the threatening her for not becoming a prostitute. I have no problem with forcing people to get a job and get off of welfare, but i have a problem with forcing them into prostitution.
 
  • #11
Where do you come up with socialism?

Look's like someone still actually thinks problems like this have something to do with socialism of some sort ... kind of a straw man.
 
  • #12
franznietzsche said:
Um, i think you misunderstand the use of the term "traditional values" but whatever. Otherwise you just agreed with everything i said.

I have nothing against the legalization of prostitution, i really don't care about that. Its the threatening her for not becoming a prostitute. I have no problem with forcing people to get a job and get off of welfare, but i have a problem with forcing them into prostitution.
They're not forcing her to go into prostitution, they're saying she has to get a job, any job, prostitution included, the exact words: "any woman under 55 who has been out of work for more than a year can be forced to take an available job" this includes prostitution.
No one's actually going to prosecute someone for this. I wouldn't worry about it.
 
  • #13
plus said:
It is needed to force people off welfare, otherwise they would stay on it for ever, - if someone would pay me lots for not going to work, they I would stay doing this for ever.
Prostitution should not be allowed however.

Heyhey, isn't that ugly market regulation ?
 
  • #14
vanesch said:
Heyhey, isn't that ugly market regulation ?

No, its morality.
 
  • #15
No, its Algeria
 
  • #16
franznietzsche said:
Um, i think you misunderstand the use of the term "traditional values"

But that's the great thing about the phrase. It has no widely accepted definition and can be regarded as meaning just about anything anyone wants, so long as they refer to values of the past.

Republicans, conservative democrats, liberal democrats, populists, libertarians, white power groups - they can all use the phrase and be comfortable that it applies to them, and no one can say they are wrong.
 
  • #17
Locrian said:
But that's the great thing about the phrase. It has no widely accepted definition and can be regarded as meaning just about anything anyone wants, so long as they refer to values of the past.

Republicans, conservative democrats, liberal democrats, populists, libertarians, white power groups - they can all use the phrase and be comfortable that it applies to them, and no one can say they are wrong.

"They're wrong"

Wow, that was amazingly easy for something i can't do. :wink:
 
  • #18
Whoops, I meant to say "and no one can show they're wrong. :D

Because, thanks to the mediocrity of the phrase, they aren't.
 
  • #19
It's all part of good propaganda.
 
  • #20
Locrian said:
Whoops, I meant to say "and no one can show they're wrong. :D

Because, thanks to the mediocrity of the phrase, they aren't.

You're right (of course).

And, to prove this, to me, prostitution is one of those good old traditional values! After all, it is the oldest profession in the world, no ?


:smile:
 
  • #21
Murder, Spying, Smuggling, Wars, blah blah blah, so many traditional values.. how many of them do you think Bush supports?
 
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  • #22
Smurf said:
Murder, Spying, Smuggling, Wars, blah blah blah, so many traditional values.. how many of them do you think Bush supports?


Did i ever say bush supported traditional values? no.

So go beat your own bush. *that works on far too many levels*
 

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