Why does center of mass behave

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of the center of mass of extended objects, specifically in the context of motion and rotation. Participants explore why the center of mass follows a parabolic path similar to that of a point mass, despite the extended nature of objects like a baseball bat.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the implications of Newton's 2nd law as it relates to the center of mass and question the definitions and meanings of terms like acceleration of the center of mass. There are inquiries about the relationship between translational and rotational motion, as well as the nature of internal forces within a system.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided clarifications regarding the definitions of terms and the nature of forces acting on the center of mass. However, there remains a lack of consensus on certain concepts, particularly regarding the connection between rotational and translational movements and the interpretation of internal forces.

Contextual Notes

Participants express confusion over the definitions and applications of formulas related to the center of mass, indicating a need for further exploration of these concepts. There is also mention of external resources, such as first-year physics texts, which have not satisfactorily addressed the questions raised.

xailer
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Why when we throw an extended object like a baseball bat will the center of mass follow the same parabolic path that we expect for a smaller obeject like ball, while the bat itself will rotate around this ceneter of mass?

Why does center of mass behave like a simpler object?

thank you
 
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If you imagine that an extended body (mass = M) as a set of smaller mass elements (mass = m_1, m_2,...), Newton's 2nd law implies that [itex]F_{net} = M a_{cm}[/itex].

It goes like this. Start with the definition of center of mass:
[tex]M\vec{r}_{cm} = m_1 \vec{r}_1 + m_2 \vec{r}_2 \ ...[/tex]

Now take the second derivative:
[tex]M\vec{a}_{cm} = m_1 \vec{a}_1 + m_2 \vec{a}_2 \ ...[/tex]

From Newton's 2nd law applied to each mass element, recognize that:
[tex]M\vec{a}_{cm} = \vec{F}_1 + \vec{F}_2 \ ...[/tex]
[tex]M\vec{a}_{cm} = \vec{F}_{net} = \vec{F}_{external}[/tex]

Note that internal forces cancel out and only external forces count. This can be summarized by saying that the cm of an object (or collection of particles) moves as though all the mass were concentrated at the cm and all the external forces were applied at that point.

(For more details, consult any first year physics text.)
 
What does [itex]a_{cm}[/itex] mean? Acceleration of a part of an object that is 1 cm in length?

If that is the case, then [tex]M\vec{r}_{cm}[/tex] must mean torque of a part of the body that is 1 cm in length?

Doc Al said:
[tex]M\vec{r}_{cm} = m_1 \vec{r}_1 + m_2 \vec{r}_2 \ ...[/tex]
Isn't that a formula for finding how far from the rotation axis a center of mass is? Aren't rotational and translational movements two different things. I don't see how you can combine the two if that is what you are doing here

Note that internal forces cancel out and only external forces count.
what would internal forces be in this case?

This can be summarized by saying that the cm of an object (or collection of particles) moves as though all the mass were concentrated at the cm and all the external forces were applied at that point.
I'm sorry but I can't seem to be able to see the connection

(For more details, consult any first year physics text.)
I did and they don't answer my questions
 
xailer said:
What does [itex]a_{cm}[/itex] mean? Acceleration of a part of an object that is 1 cm in length?

If that is the case, then [tex]M\vec{r}_{cm}[/tex] must mean torque of a part of the body that is 1 cm in length?

No, the subscript "cm" stands for "center of mass".

Isn't that a formula for finding how far from the rotation axis a center of mass is? Aren't rotational and translational movements two different things. I don't see how you can combine the two if that is what you are doing here

No, that's the formula for locating the center of mass.

what would internal forces be in this case?

It could be anything that results in zero net force: Gravitational attraction, a string that connects the two masses, whatever.
 

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