The Zarqawis and their lieutenants

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the figure of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and the portrayal of his lieutenants in the media. Participants explore the implications of media narratives, the existence and significance of Zarqawi, and the broader context of how such figures are represented in conflict reporting. The conversation touches on themes of myth-making, propaganda, and the dynamics of military intelligence.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the media has constructed the persona of Zarqawi to support political narratives, implying he may not be as significant as portrayed.
  • Others argue that the numerous claims about Zarqawi's lieutenants reflect a body count rather than a coherent organizational structure.
  • There is a suggestion that the media's reliance on military reports may contribute to the exaggeration of Zarqawi's influence and existence.
  • Some participants question the validity of the media's portrayal, noting that different outlets, including Arabic news sources, contribute to the narrative.
  • A participant humorously compares the frequency of Zarqawi's reported deaths and resurrections to comic book characters.
  • Concerns are raised about the potential for military and political agendas to inflate the importance of captured individuals within Zarqawi's network.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on Zarqawi's existence or significance. Multiple competing views remain regarding the media's role in shaping perceptions of Zarqawi and his lieutenants.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the accuracy of intelligence reports and the motivations behind media narratives, highlighting the complexity of the situation and the potential for misinformation.

Mercator
On another board, some time ago, we discussed how the media have created "Zarqawi", to give the enemy a name and to support Bush in his claims that he is actually fighting a terrorist group, and not a resistance. We are now a year further and it's becoming a real joke: this Zarqawi must really have an arsenal of lieutenants.

The No. 2 official in the al-Qaida in Iraq organization.'
"The top deputy to Jordanian militant Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Mohammed Salah Sutton, aka Abu Zubair (8/14/05)

"A lieutenant of al-Qaida terror boss Abu Musab al Zarqawi."
Abu Abd al-Aziz (7/13/05)

"Zarqawi's 'main leader in Baghdad'"
Khalid Suleiman Darwish, aka Abu Alghadiya (6/26/05)

A Syrian dentist...was described by Arab media as the 'number two' in Iraq's al Qaeda network and tipped to succeed its leader Abu Musab Al Zarqawi."
Mohammed Khalaf Shakar, aka Abu Talha (6/17/05)

"A top lieutenant of terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Mullah Mahdi, aka Abu Abdul Rahman (6/4/05)

"Suspected deputy of terrorist leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Abu Karrar (5/27/05)

"The Washington Post quoted a Zarqawi lieutenant by the nom-de-guerre of Abu Karrar as saying the Jordanian militant was shot and wounded in fighting with US forces near the western city of Ramadi."
Mullah Kamel al-Assawadi (5/25/05)

"Described as one of al-Zarqawi's top lieutenants."
Agha Umar (5/25/05)

"A top aide to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Amar Adnan Muhammad Hamzah al-Zubaydi, aka Abu al-Abbas (5/9/05)

"A high-ranking aide to terrorist leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Ghassan Muhammed Amin Husayn al-Rawi (4/26/05)

"A key associate of Iraq's most wanted militant, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Hamza Ali Ahmed al-Wdimizyar, aka Abu Majid (beginning of April-05)

"Zarqawi associate"
Salman Aref Abulkadir Khwamurad al-Zardowe, aka Abu Sharif (beginning of April-05)

"Zarqawi associate"
Taifor Abulsattar Malallah (3/8/05)

"One of the 'princes' of Musab al-Zarqawi's terrorist group."
Talib Mikhlif Arsan Walman al-Dulaymi, aka Abu Qutaybah (2/25/05)

"Iraqi forces have captured a man described as a trusted aide to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Mohammed Najm Ibrahim, aka Mohammed Najm (2/25/05)

"Zarqawi lieutenant"
Adel Mujtaba, aka Abu Rim (2/20/05)

"A propaganda chief of al-Qaeda's frontman in Iraq, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Anat Mohammed Hamat al-Kays, aka Abu Alid (1/28/05)

"High-level Zarqawi lieutenant"
Sami Mohammed Ali Said Jaaf, aka Abu Omar Kurdi (1/25/05)

"A senior aide to Abu Musab al Zarqawi"
"The 'most lethal' top lieutenant of Al Qaeda's leader in Iraq."
Ismael Jeddan (1/23/05)

"The raids also netted a man identified as Ismael Jeddan, an alleged associate of al-Zarqawi."
Ali Hamad Ardani Yasin Isawi (1/20/05)

"top lieutenant"
Inad Mohammed Qais (1/20/05)

"The deputy prime minister for national security affairs, Barham Salih, later told a news conference that authorities have arrested a third Zarqawi lieutenant."
Salah Salman Idaaj Matar Luhaybi, aka Abu Sayf (12/31/04)

"Zarqawi's chief of operations in Baghdad"
Fadil Hussain Ahmed al-Kurdi, aka Abu Ubaydah al-Kurdi, aka Ridha (12/30/04)

"A senior member of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi's network."
Abdul Aziz Sa'dun Ahmed Hamduni, aka Abu Ahmed (12/22/04)

"Zarqawi-linked leader"
Hassan Ibrahim Farhan Zyda (12/14/04)

"An aide to Iraq's most-wanted man, Jordanian Islamist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Abu Saeed (11/26/04)

"A lieutenant of Iraq's most feared terrorist leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Nameless (10/23/04)

The US military has arrested a 'senior leader' in the network run by Jordanian mastermind Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Omar Yusef Juma'a, aka Abu Anas al-Shami (9/25/04)

"A senior aide of the Jordanian al Qaeda mastermind, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
Umar Baziyani (6/4/04)

"A top aide of al-Qaeda suspect Abu Musab al-Zarqawi"
"His capture removes one of Zarqawi's most valuable officers from his network."
Abu Mohammed Hamza (2/24/04)

"A key lieutenant to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi."
Hassan Ghul (2/23/04)

"The letter was found on al-Zarqawi lieutenant Hassan Ghul, a Pakistani captured in Iraq."
The letter in reference was a "17-page letter to senior al Qaeda leaders written by terror mastermind Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, who asked for help starting a Muslim civil war between Iraqi Sunnis and Shiites."
Nameless (4/30/03)

"An associate of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi has been captured in the Baghdad area."
From the looks of it, I think everyone in Iraq is about two-degrees from Zarqawi

http://www.rense.com/general68/zar.htm
 
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The lieutenants of Zarqawi are simply the body counts of the new millennium.
 
Monty Python did this years ago with ...

Is your name not Bruce then?
 
So, wait - are you arguing that he doesn't exist or that he isn't who the media says he is? And if the former and "the media created him", how, exactly did they do that? It isn't as if "the media" is a single entity with a single mind. In fact, some of those quotes of yours are from Arabic news outlets!
 
Not to mention that man himself has been killed and brought back to life more times than a comic book character.
 
this guy has some vary tinatious recruiters... it Sounds like he's been getting his but kicked for a long time and he's just about to give up but on the other hand, maybe that kind of but kicking doesn't bother him?
 
russ_watters said:
So, wait - are you arguing that he doesn't exist or that he isn't who the media says he is? And if the former and "the media created him", how, exactly did they do that? It isn't as if "the media" is a single entity with a single mind. In fact, some of those quotes of yours are from Arabic news outlets!
I suspect the point is that to give an illusion of progress the coalition and it's allies promote run of the mill prisoners to the highest ranks.

When Britain fought the IRA they did the same, to the point where the IRA was regarded as the army with the fastest promotion track in the world. All you had to do was get captured and you became a general :biggrin:
 
RussWatters said:
So, wait - are you arguing that he doesn't exist or that he isn't who the media says he is? And if the former and "the media created him", how, exactly did they do that? It isn't as if "the media" is a single entity with a single mind. In fact, some of those quotes of yours are from Arabic news outlets!

the media relies on military reports, and they take them as truth...
 
I suppose that next you are going to say that they rehearse those "impromptu back and forth" question and answer sessions, Bush has with the troops.:biggrin:
 
  • #10
russ_watters said:
So, wait - are you arguing that he doesn't exist or that he isn't who the media says he is? And if the former and "the media created him", how, exactly did they do that? It isn't as if "the media" is a single entity with a single mind. In fact, some of those quotes of yours are from Arabic news outlets!
I was going to try to explain, but since you seem to be the only one not undestanding the implications of this, I'll just presume you do not wish to understand, so why bother.
 
  • #11
We were paying $10,000 a pop for any info on Zarqawi. The recipients apparently told us what we wanted to hear.


How US fuelled myth of Zarqawi the mastermind
By Adrian Blomfield outside Fallujah
(Filed: 04/10/2004)

Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the terrorist leader believed to be responsible for the abduction of Kenneth Bigley, is 'more myth than man', according to American military intelligence agents in Iraq.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/04/wirq04.xml

Several sources said the importance of Zarqawi, blamed for many of the most spectacular acts of violence in Iraq, has been exaggerated by flawed intelligence and the Bush administration's desire to find "a villain" for the post-invasion mayhem.
 
Last edited:
  • #12
I think I just made 10.000 $. I met TSM today and it was a terrifying experience. I don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I really think TSM is the top Deputy of Zarqawi! All the evidence is there. I don't have to draw your attention to the extremist propaganda that he used to smear on this board. And when I met him in his secret hiding place I knew immediately: this man is a Deputy! He was accompagnied by one of his militias. The guy left during our conversation and I really thought that he was going to get his AK47 and blow my head off. Then TSM himself: not only had he a big tattoo "I 'little heart' mama" on his arm (who else can mama be for this devil than BL ?) But most frightening was the killing look in his eyes. I saw immediately what this man would be able to do for his belief: kill, murder, drink Budweiser, ANYTHING! It was the same icecold look as in the eyes of Zarqawi. Not that I ever saw Zarqawi's eyes, but I can imagine them. Certainly now that I have seen TSM's. Does anybody know where I can cash my check?
 

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