Is studying too much bad?

[daniel_i_l]

I've found that in the past month or so I've been studying math a lot (more that 8 hours a day). I really like it but am I studying to much? Should I be "playing outside" and enjoying the world (other that math) while I can? Or just do what I enjoy the most? For some reason this thought hit me a few days ago and it's made my motivation go down a little.
Any thought/advice?
Thanks.

[Maxwell]

Do what you enjoy most. If it's studying 8 hours a day, then by all means, do it.

[Schrodinger's Dog]

Do whatever you're comfortable with, if you can do 8 hours and not feel burnt out or have any negative impact then do it. I have done long study periods sometimes as long as 12 hours, but I generally mix it up with recreation too, so I don't get too burnt out, and I find you can only do so much before you stop absorbing information effectively, but everyone's different, whatever works, works. You'll work out what's best for you by trial and error I'm sure.

[ice109]

this is a philosophical question (is the vitality of youth valuable?) whose answer is unique to you.

[fizziks]

Not to the point where you will isolate yourself socially. There are more important things in life too, like friends and family and having fun while you're still young.

[mathwonk]

make sure you get some exercise. even if your main goal is studying, it helps to be physically healthy and strong, or you cannot even study as much.

remember you have an intellectual self, an emotional self, a spiritual self, and a physical self, and all need to be in harmony, as the mystics put it.

but the old formula says 8 hours of study, 8 hours of sleep, still leaves 8 hours for food, errands, and play.

[ice109]

make sure you get some exercise. even if your main goal is studying, it helps to be physically healthy and strong, or you cannot even study as much.

remember you have an intellectual self, an emotional self, a spiritual self, and a physical self, and all need to be in harmony, as the mystics put it.

but the old formula says 8 hours of study, 8 hours of sleep, still leaves 8 hours for food, errands, and play.

you're forgetting about actual class

[JasonRox]

8 hours is pushing it, in my opinion. During the summer, sure if you don't work. During school, you won't even have time to have a social life. You might not think it's a big deal, but when you may seek a social life it might hit you really hard on how you don't have one and neither do you possess the social skills to get one. What happens after that? My vote is on severe depression.

[ice109]

8 hours is pushing it, in my opinion. During the summer, sure if you don't work. During school, you won't even have time to have a social life. You might not think it's a big deal, but when you may seek a social life it might hit you really hard on how you don't have one and neither do you possess the social skills to get one. What happens after that? My vote is on severe depression.

yea its odd but true that socializing takes practice just like everything else

[JasonRox]

yea its odd but true that socializing takes practice just like everything else

Yeah, it really does. Of course, I sound harsh about it, but I'm saying what the reality is going to be if you choose to ignore it like some students.

You need a balance like mathwonk said.

[mjsd]

I've found that in the past month or so I've been studying math a lot (more that 8 hours a day). I really like it but am I studying to much? Should I be "playing outside" and enjoying the world (other that math) while I can? Or just do what I enjoy the most? For some reason this thought hit me a few days ago and it's made my motivation go down a little.
Any thought/advice?
Thanks.

try as you might, but eventually you will be burnt out and shall "play outside" anyway. Doing something for too long will cause you to lose interest. especially when you have been stuck on a problem for a few days, and getting frustrated, starting to lose interest, that would be a sign to really take a break.
remember there are always more things to study than there is time available, so like it or not, you shall let your brain to recharge at some point.

[mathwonk]

when i was an undergrd at harvard it was suggeated we spend 8 Hours on class + study, and so on.... but i think it took more study than that. but this was considered normal, not excessive.

[JasonRox]

when i was an undergrd at harvard it was suggeated we spend 8 Hours on class + study, and so on.... but i think it took more study than that. but this was considered normal, not excessive.

If you spend 8 hours a day studying and going to class, that's pretty normal. That's like having an 8 hour work day.

[mathwonk]

yes, but we thought it optimistic. top students went to the library when it opened and left when it closed.

[mathwonk]

let me remind of one thing: as students we often take pride in how smart we think we are, but in college and professional life, success is measured by how much we work.

[JasonRox]

let me remind of one thing: as students we often take pride in how smart we think we are, but in college and professional life, success is measured by how much we work.

But remember, that's not true. I have to disagree. That's if you measure success in life as something like how much money you make and how high your grades are and if you're the best student or not.

Remember the famous quote...

"And in the end it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." - Abraham Lincoln

A life working all day isn't much of a life filled with success at all.

[pivoxa15]

But remember, that's not true. I have to disagree. That's if you measure success in life as something like how much money you make and how high your grades are and if you're the best student or not.

Remember the famous quote...

"And in the end it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." - Abraham Lincoln

A life working all day isn't much of a life filled with success at all.

The thing is if you talk about things like 'life' as in your quote it can't be well defined and measured. Life for one person might mean being at the beach whereas life for another might be doing problems. Both type willl say the other has wasted their life.

[Karatechop]

Not to the point where you will isolate yourself socially. There are more important things in life too, like friends and family and having fun while you're still young.

This is something that it took me till my third year of college to realize. I had like a 4.0 for the first two years however I was killing myself and not enjoying things. I was miserable. I do attend college 5 hours from my home but lately Ive been trying to get home every 2 or 3 weeks for a couple of days and trying to be sure to play some games with my college buddies.

[JasonRox]

This is something that it took me till my third year of college to realize. I had like a 4.0 for the first two years however I was killing myself and not enjoying things. I was miserable. I do attend college 5 hours from my home but lately Ive been trying to get home every 2 or 3 weeks for a couple of days and trying to be sure to play some games with my college buddies.

Exactly, same here. I had the same experience.

Once you hit a balance, you're literally on top of the world.

[MadScientist 1000]

I would recommend that you take probably 30 minute breaks and do whatever you want, so that you don't get burnt out. If you do get burnt out, those next few hours are going to be worthless, since your body is going to be too tired to focus on studies and you'll find yourself most likely going to sleep.

[PhysiSmo]

Indeed, like most guys say, don't push yourself beyond your limits. When you feel tired and dizzy, just take a break. It's meaningless not to do so, you'll only hurt yourself for nothing, since your performance is terribly low in such situations.

Also, it's imperative that you're honest to yourself. You should only do things that you like, not things that you wished to like. Let's say you study calculus, for example, for 5-6 consecutive hours, taking breaks or not. If you begin to feel pretty tired and confused, end it there, give yourself some time to relax. Avoid thoughts like "Why am I tired? I like studying calculus, I really enjoy it, what happened here? Maybe I should try harder, this is not me...Yeap, I'll just keep on reading!".

Every day is different, and we're not robots..Just cool down, be honest to yourself and you'll readily find the suited balance!

[Sojourner01]

Realise that the 'nerd' stereotype was most likely propagated by intelligent, hardworking people who aren't jealous of intelligence, but scornful of a lack of social acumen. 'Nerd' in school is acceptable and is probably in truth a showing of positive qualities. In college, you're supposed to have grown up and be surrounded by intelligent, motivated people - all of whom have positive qualities and an opinion worth consideration. If these peers think you study too much and socialise too little, they probably have a point. If you can't strike up a conversation with everyone in your dorm unit about something or other, you probably have your priorities wrong.

[^_^physicist]

Being one who overworked/streched myself too thin in the last year I can safely say that: yes, you can study too much.

I neglected my health for nearly a year, as well as my relationship with girlfriend and my other close friends.

I had to actually be rushed to the hospital for overexertion which had resulted in triggering a repressed anxeity and stress disorder (When I arrived at the hospital I had all of the signs of an appendictisis; except for the swelling appendix).

I didn't think I was over-studying, I thought that working 8-10 hours a day on top of classes (which was about 4-6hours a day) wasn't going to hurt me. I ended up running on empty...and my brain just decided to literatlly stop. I couldn't focus on anything. I was tried, depressed, underweight, and in a cycle of perpetual stress.

It has taken four and a half months since this incident to recover from it. I stayed in classes during my breakdown, heck I even did well despite being forced to cut back on my studying.

Will I be doing something as intensive again, knowing me-yeah classwise I will put myself through the same intensities; however, I will be intimatly aware of my limits.

To sum up:
Be careful, you can over study.

[mathwonk]

jason,
by success in mathematics, i meant success in understanding concepts and in proving theorems, not making money.

and success in life to me means success in achieving your goals, nothing to do with money either, unless that is your goal. if you want a successful marriage, or to finish your novel, you also have to work at it.

maybe you are misunderstanding my use of the word "work". maybe to you that means working for someone else. to me it means thinking about and pushing on your own project.

[ice109]

" The first requisite for success is to develop the ability to focus and apply your mental and physical energies to the problem at hand - without growing weary. Because such thinking is often difficult, there seems to be no limit to which some people will go to avoid the effort and labor that is associated with it...."

Thomas Edison

not that edison is revered around here but he has a point.

[webdivx]

i wish i liked studying... man ur lucky

[symbolipoint]

i wish i liked studying... man ur lucky
Are you serious? To gain knowledge you must study. No study - No knowledge. You might be responding to the pressure to gain knowledge for academic credit and a grade. That is a stress; something to manage and then move on to the next assignment and the next quiz/test. Really, you NEED to like what you study, but when you are on a strict schedule for earning credit, some of the fun is reduced.

[J77]

Open question:

If you have to study extremely hard to understand something, do you think you are really cut out for that subject?

I guess I'm not talking about working hard to get a good grade and a job in a bank, or the like, after uni -- some people do work hard at things which don't come naturally to them to acheive these goals.

It's more directed at people who want to go on to have careers in academic subjects.

I don't know about physics, but for me, maths has always been quite simple to understand -- through elementary school I breezed it, coming up with formulas before we'd been taught them, without really trying for them. And, at uni, I didn't have to work too hard -- apart from possibly fluid dynamic type subjects; I found the complex analysis type subjects sat quite easy with me after looking at them a few times, although was never really interested in them. My PhD didn't cause me too much stress either.

We can only talk from our own experiences, but if I had to sit down and really work all day on something to understand it, I think I'd leave it alone -- perhaps that's a sign of impatience. Or, perhaps, I like projects to evolve at a natural rate, I don't want to naively try to understand something in X amount of days. I like to learn at a nice relaxed rate :smile:

[jostpuur]

I've found that in the past month or so I've been studying math a lot (more that 8 hours a day). I really like it but am I studying to much? Should I be "playing outside" and enjoying the world (other that math) while I can? Or just do what I enjoy the most? For some reason this thought hit me a few days ago and it's made my motivation go down a little.
Any thought/advice?
Thanks.

You wouldn't bother giving some hints on how you succeeded in this? My studying efficiency is quite poor. I always get bored of some subject too quickly when I try to read, and I'm not happy with it.

[pivoxa15]

You wouldn't bother giving some hints on how you succeeded in this? My studying efficiency is quite poor. I always get bored of some subject too quickly when I try to read, and I'm not happy with it.

I'd say just love/curiosity for the material. The love comes naturally. It's the curisoity that drives the time spent studying. If you are studying for materialistic purposes then you may be able to study for intense period but will eventually get sick of it in the long term. Although it depends how materialistic you are.

[JasonRox]

I'd say just love/curiosity for the material. The love comes naturally. It's the curisoity that drives the time spent studying. If you are studying for materialistic purposes then you may be able to study for intense period but will eventually get sick of it in the long term. Although it depends how materialistic you are.

What the hell are you talking about?

You can love the stuff and still not be efficiently studying. You can love the stuff and still get bored studying it. That's just the way it is. What does materialism have anything to do with it? I have absolutely no idea. I know materialistic people who can study without any problems.

If you want to be efficient about studying, it's all about practicing. Keep studying. Try something new. It's just like working out or jogging. You have to practice and practice and eventually you'll get better.

Passion and love can only take you so far. You have to do the rest of the work yourself. It won't just happen naturally, so I have no idea where you got this from.

[jostpuur]

What the hell are you talking about?


That was slightly too provocative. Pivoxa15 of course had a point there.

My problem is certainly not a materialistic attitude in studying. I am genuinely interested in mathematics and physics. In mathematics my problem is that it is difficult to remain motivated, when I don't understand the benefits of some definitions or theorems. In physics my problem is that the explanations are too confusing for me to understand, and I am not convinced that it is always my own fault.

So my question was meant to mean, that how can you remain motivated, when obstacles such as these start to come on the way.

[JasonRox]

That was slightly too provocative. Pivoxa15 of course had a point there.

My problem is certainly not a materialistic attitude in studying. I am genuinely interested in mathematics and physics. In mathematics my problem is that it is difficult to remain motivated, when I don't understand the benefits of some definitions or theorems. In physics my problem is that the explanations are too confusing for me to understand, and I am not convinced that it is always my own fault.

So my question was meant to mean, that how can you remain motivated, when obstacles such as these start to come on the way.

Loving it isn't going to help under the purpose of a theorem any better. Loving it isn't going to help you understand the explanations in physics.

Like I said, it has very little to do with love or passion to study efficiently.

Also, like I said, it's like jogging. You can hate jogging more than anything in the world, but if you jog everyday, you'll get better just because. Same thing with studying.

[jostpuur]

Also, like I said, it's like jogging. You can hate jogging more than anything in the world, but if you jog everyday, you'll get better just because. Same thing with studying.

By strange coincidence, I've had difficulty deciding if my feelings towards physics are closer to love or hate.

[ice109]

Open question:

If you have to study extremely hard to understand something, do you think you are really cut out for that subject?

I guess I'm not talking about working hard to get a good grade and a job in a bank, or the like, after uni -- some people do work hard at things which don't come naturally to them to acheive these goals.

It's more directed at people who want to go on to have careers in academic subjects.

I don't know about physics, but for me, maths has always been quite simple to understand -- through elementary school I breezed it, coming up with formulas before we'd been taught them, without really trying for them. And, at uni, I didn't have to work too hard -- apart from possibly fluid dynamic type subjects; I found the complex analysis type subjects sat quite easy with me after looking at them a few times, although was never really interested in them. My PhD didn't cause me too much stress either.

We can only talk from our own experiences, but if I had to sit down and really work all day on something to understand it, I think I'd leave it alone -- perhaps that's a sign of impatience. Or, perhaps, I like projects to evolve at a natural rate, I don't want to naively try to understand something in X amount of days. I like to learn at a nice relaxed rate :smile:

if it didn't challenge you, your phd, why did you do it?

[JasonRox]

if it didn't challenge you, your phd, why did you do it?

He's talking about something different.

[ice109]

He's talking about something different.

:confused: what? is it something other than what his posts says because i read the post...

[pivoxa15]

What the hell are you talking about?

You can love the stuff and still not be efficiently studying. You can love the stuff and still get bored studying it. That's just the way it is. What does materialism have anything to do with it? I have absolutely no idea. I know materialistic people who can study without any problems.

If you want to be efficient about studying, it's all about practicing. Keep studying. Try something new. It's just like working out or jogging. You have to practice and practice and eventually you'll get better.

Passion and love can only take you so far. You have to do the rest of the work yourself. It won't just happen naturally, so I have no idea where you got this from.

jostpuur was asking daniel_i_l how he/she can put so much time into study.
So I was only answering that question. It may be that daniel_i_l's time spent studying is inefficient.

Efficiency does keep practice but if you practice into the long terms than that drive to succeed will most easily come from love for the material.

[pivoxa15]

That was slightly too provocative. Pivoxa15 of course had a point there.

My problem is certainly not a materialistic attitude in studying. I am genuinely interested in mathematics and physics. In mathematics my problem is that it is difficult to remain motivated, when I don't understand the benefits of some definitions or theorems. In physics my problem is that the explanations are too confusing for me to understand, and I am not convinced that it is always my own fault.

So my question was meant to mean, that how can you remain motivated, when obstacles such as these start to come on the way.

Love is a broad word. Another important and more specific word is intrinsic. Study for intrinsic purposes. A lot of the time people do things to be competitive. Sport is a prime example. Study can be as well especially in undergrad and more so in high school. You may want to study more to get good grades in order to impress your peers or future career prospects. You may not think about them directly but these things drive everyone and there is silent voice in your brain telling you to do something else that you may succeed in. Hence you get discouraged from your maths and physics. At least thats what happens to me often. I know some people who succeeded in high school but went backwards in uni because the competitiveness was gone.

However recently there did come a time when I studied too much during semester and just couldn't do any self study during the holidays. But I have the feeling that I had been too materialistic in my attitude during semester as I was aiming for certain marks and that took its toll later on. So now I am going for a different attitude, one that is more intrinsic. I like Feynman's quote "Know how to solve every problem that has been solved." As opposed to do only the problems in your subject or area you are paid in. And also do them no matter how frustraing they may be. And don't get discouraged no matter how easily someone else can do a problem you are stuck on.

I also like the advice by Terry Tao.

Its all easy said then done I have to admit.

[pivoxa15]

Loving it isn't going to help under the purpose of a theorem any better. Loving it isn't going to help you understand the explanations in physics.

Like I said, it has very little to do with love or passion to study efficiently.

Also, like I said, it's like jogging. You can hate jogging more than anything in the world, but if you jog everyday, you'll get better just because. Same thing with studying.

I was only claiming that love can help you spend more time on the thing that you love, that's all.

[J77]

if it didn't challenge you, your phd, why did you do it?Not being stressed about something is not the same as it not being a challenge.

[Llama77]

in my undergrad i spent a min of 12 hrs a day at the librry studying all subjects each and every day.

[Sojourner01]

in my undergrad i spent a min of 12 hrs a day at the librry studying all subjects each and every day.

I would have called that a borderline case of obsessive-compulsive disorder. If you were a friend of mine I would have urged you to a psychiatrist.

[rocomath]

i study an avg a day of 3hrs mon-thurs & 5hrs fri-sun. but 12hrs a day? wtf ... slap yours3lf

[Werg22]

The amount of time one spends on exploring a subject is less important than the way someone explores it. Some are just naturally adept at exploring a certain subject in a way that is very efficiently. An adept person might learn more in 10 min than a mediocre in a year. This has nothing to do with the amount the two acquire, but rather the depth of their perceptions.

[Llama77]

I would have called that a borderline case of obsessive-compulsive disorder. If you were a friend of mine I would have urged you to a psychiatrist.

thats what it takes for me to get C's in school. I cant help it,

[Werg22]

If that's what it takes for you to get a C, you are studying in fundamentally flawed way.

[threetheoreom]

If that's what it takes for you to get a C, you are studying in fundamentally flawed way.


So more generally what attitude should one have when it comes to studying (regardless of love or competition) and what is considered good study habits?

[ice109]

If that's what it takes for you to get a C, you are studying in fundamentally flawed way.

i think he's exaggerating. no one could possibly study 12 hours a day and get a C. i can't imagine anything that doesn't become transparent after a couple of hours, let alone half a day.

[JasonRox]

i think he's exaggerating. no one could possibly study 12 hours a day and get a C. i can't imagine anything that doesn't become transparent after a couple of hours, let alone half a day.

If you're studying 3 hours or more a day and still only crack a C, you're not really that cut out for it.

[ice109]

If you're studying 3 hours or more a day and still only crack a C, you're not really that cut out for it.

i think that's a really silly statement

[cristo]

i think that's a really silly statement

I think it's quite realistic. Three hours study every day, on top of attending classes, is a large amount of study. Doing this amount of work for an entire year, and still only managing to scape mediocre grades does seem to imply that they are either not cut out for the subject, or that they are going about studying in the incorrect way.

[ice109]

I think it's quite realistic. Three hours study every day, on top of attending classes, is a large amount of study. Doing this amount of work for an entire year, and still only managing to scape mediocre grades does seem to imply that they are either not cut out for the subject, or that they are going about studying in the incorrect way.

the latter is quite possible, the former is a mean thought

[symbolipoint]

Expand your awareness here. What is difficult for some people could be a tough but manageable challenge for other people. This generally is the "being cut out for" the subject, but if the student's interest is strong, he may be unwilling to change direction in chosen major field of study. A fully strong effort for a difficult course through the first time might earn a C; the same fully strong effort in the same course through this course the second time will yield a B - or it should, if the student is repeating the particular course and gave full efforts in both terms. Now, if the student does not earn a better grade the second time than the first, then something is wrong.

How much time per week should someone study a difficult typical undergraduate lower division course? I'd say that for a difficult course at that level, maybe 2 or more hours per day, 6 days per week should be enough the successfully pass (with a C minimum.). If this be a repeat of the course, then B minimum. Twelve hours of study on one course per week should be reasonable if the student is very concerned about the need to succeed in it. Maybe MORE than 12 hours per week if the student is really so motivated.