View Full Version : Universities, boyfriends and lies
Thallium
May2-04, 09:03 AM
Are there anyone here who studies at the University of Wisconsin, Madison?
Does anyone KNOW any students there?
I need to find an answer to the following question and, please help, the questions concerns whether I will break up with my boyfriend or not because I think he is lying to me:
Has there EVER been a university that has sent "invitations" to their former students where they ask if they would like to finish their education, even if those students ended their education around 15 years ago?
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE HELP! I need to find out whether my boyfriend is lying or not. I have a bad feeling about this relationship and I NEED TO KNOW if this is possible. I cannot stand being so worried and discomfortable about this anymore - I am sick of it. Please help! I hoped this would be a good place to ask as I know there are many Americans here and American students.
Call the university registrar and ask them.
- Warren
I agree with chroot, Thallium. Ask around and see what you find out. Also, I suggest tricking him into vowing truth or something like that, then ask him. If he is lying to you, then he should get a bit nervous if you start hinting that you suspect him. If he doen't get nervous or twitchy or both, then he's either a really good liar or he's telling the truth, and you shouldn't be so paranoid about him.
Thallium
May4-04, 03:10 PM
I can't help being so paranoid. But no, he has never become nervous when I ask him questions of suspicion.
Your paranoia is going to ruin every relationship you'll ever have. Find a way to get past it. Go see a therapist if you can't.
- Warren
The_Professional
May5-04, 01:41 AM
I can't help being so paranoid. But no, he has never become nervous when I ask him questions of suspicion.
Has he gave you any reason in the past for you to doubt him? Has he ever done anything wrong?
As suggested, call the registrar and find things out for yourself. The truth shall set you free.
The truth shall set you free.
Ah the cliche.....
Unless he has done something wrong in the past I doubt there should be any problems. Has be been talking on the phone a lot or anything? I mean, more than usual? Does he act differently, those are just a coupla hints that you know something is up. But do what the other guys said.
I used to worry when my (then) gf went out and I wasnt there, I could trust her but not all the guys in the club. We did have a few arguements till I just said "Fine, I wont give a crap then"...lol
Thallium
May5-04, 04:22 PM
Has he gave you any reason in the past for you to doubt him? Has he ever done anything wrong?
As suggested, call the registrar and find things out for yourself. The truth shall set you free.
Yes, he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines,
ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan, and before he "received" that letter, I joked about not wanting to be with him if he was not well-educated and had completed his degree in engineering. Perhaps he took this seriously. I am happy with him as he is, and he seemed to understand that, but... I am still anxious. There are also other reasons for me being unsure: He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan(this is getting very personal), I DON'T. No people are the childran of Satan. We do not share the same views. He does not complain to me about my views, but he does not know this particular opinion of mine.
Well, I get so upset when teling about this. Please, no comments on my views relating to God and Jews, no criticism: I am asking for advice, not derision.
All of these bad signals are part of my displeasefulness with our relationship. Should I break up with him? I am closing in on that thought. I deserve something better than such a hostile and hateful man. I cannot stand it, but at the same time I love him. But I am not convinced that I have ever been in love with him.
Suddenly this turned into an enormously personal matter, but I have to air my grievance! Forgive me if I insult anyone!
Yes, he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines,
ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan
.......
He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan
I don't even know if you're joking lol
Ummm if he is like that, why would you wanna be with him?? There are plenty of NICE guys out there... I dont want to offend but it just seems like the people who dont deserve it get all the the luck and the nice girls.
That's why nice guys make great scientists; women are not interested in them :wink:
uh oh....what about "nice guys are nobodies..."? I am not going to Uni but I'm a nice guy... Scout's honour!!!
Uh yeah, Thallium, if you have such tremendous differences in your value systems, you will not work in a long-term relationship -- period. No matter how much fun you have here and there on casual dates.
I turn down women all the time over much less significant differences in world-view.
- Warren
I turn down women all the time over much less significant differences in world-view.
You're not like Seinfeld are you? Manhands, the virgin, mulva, the girl who might have fake boobs, the girl who laughs like elmer fud sitting on a juicer......
Not quite that bad, but I've turned down women for being too religious, too superstitious, even liking really bad music...
- Warren
Oh, and virgins over the age of 21.. definitely, they turn me off.
- Warren
Well that's not really fair since people in the US aren't even allowed to drink before 21.
Elaine: So what your saying is that 95% of our population is undatable?
Jerry: UNDATABLE!
Elaine: then how are all of these people getting together?
Jerry: Alcohol
It's probably more like 99.99%, in my opinion.
- Warren
I don't know if it's that high. Maybe you fall within that bracket because you're the one who keeps dumping people :biggrin:.
Since the divorce rate is around 50%, at least 50% of people are undatable. Then factor in that a lot of single people are undatable..... hmmm maybe 80%?
The_Professional
May5-04, 08:11 PM
Yes, he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines,
ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan, and before he "received" that letter, I joked about not wanting to be with him if he was not well-educated and had completed his degree in engineering. Perhaps he took this seriously. I am happy with him as he is, and he seemed to understand that, but... I am still anxious. There are also other reasons for me being unsure: He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan(this is getting very personal), I DON'T. No people are the childran of Satan. We do not share the same views. He does not complain to me about my views, but he does not know this particular opinion of mine.
Well, I get so upset when teling about this. Please, no comments on my views relating to God and Jews, no criticism: I am asking for advice, not derision.
All of these bad signals are part of my displeasefulness with our relationship. Should I break up with him? I am closing in on that thought. I deserve something better than such a hostile and hateful man. I cannot stand it, but at the same time I love him. But I am not convinced that I have ever been in love with him.
Should you break up with him? that's got to be the understatement of the year. Ultimately, it's your decision but with all the red flags you mentioned I won't be surprise if you break up with him.
The_Professional
May5-04, 08:21 PM
Oh, and virgins over the age of 21.. definitely, they turn me off.
- Warren
Not quite that bad, but I've turned down women for being too religious, too superstitious, even liking really bad music...
- Warren
That's a little bit too much don't you think. Those are pretty minor reasons, In my opinion. I would turn down somebody on the basis of having a bad attitude, inconsistency in behavior and actions, lack of integrity, inflexibility.
No, I think it's right on target. I'd rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't fundamentally see the world the way I do. You can do what you wish with your life.
- Warren
I'd be afraid of someone like that
The_Professional
May5-04, 08:41 PM
And I thought I was picky
You're not like Seinfeld are you? Manhands, the virgin, mulva, the girl who might have fake boobs, the girl who laughs like elmer fud sitting on a juicer......
don't forget the good looking one he turns down because Newman even turned his nose up at her...and what about the one who always wore the same dress? i love seinfeld :smile:
Ebolamonk3y
May5-04, 10:16 PM
Anyone attending University of Memphis?
Thallium, listen to me. If your profile is correct you just turned 18 a couple of weeks ago. You said that this guy dropped out of college 15 years ago. He's MUCH older than you. From what you've said about him "he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines, ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan, and before he "received" that letter, I joked about not wanting to be with him if he was not well-educated and had completed his degree in engineering. Perhaps he took this seriously. I am happy with him as he is, and he seemed to understand that, but... I am still anxious. There are also other reasons for me being unsure: He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan(this is getting very personal), I DON'T. No people are the childran of Satan."
OMG!!!!!!! What are you thinking?!?!?!? RUN AWAY from this person!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You were still a minor when you started dating this guy. Here in the US, that would be against the law.
Thallium, you are so smart, you have so much going for you. This guy is a MAJOR LOSER!!!!!!!! Not to mention SCARY.
I don't ususally give relationship advice, but this is so serious, I will make an exception. DROP HIM NOW!! This is NOT the person for you.
Please listen to me. I have a very bad feeling about this guy.
No, I think it's right on target. I'd rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't fundamentally see the world the way I do.
I can totally relate. I can't even stand to be around religious people; they're just so fundamentally evil. Dumping girls who like bad music is also understandable.
Thallium, listen to me. If your profile is correct you just turned 18 a couple of weeks ago. You said that this guy dropped out of college 15 years ago. He's MUCH older than you. From what you've said about him "he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines, ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan, and before he "received" that letter, I joked about not wanting to be with him if he was not well-educated and had completed his degree in engineering. Perhaps he took this seriously. I am happy with him as he is, and he seemed to understand that, but... I am still anxious. There are also other reasons for me being unsure: He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan(this is getting very personal), I DON'T. No people are the childran of Satan."
Thallium, I THOUGHT THAT WAS JUST SOME CREATIVE WRITING BY ANOTHER POSTER!!!!!!! You gotta be kidding.
OMG!!!!!!! What are you thinking?!?!?!? RUN AWAY from this person!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You were still a minor when you started dating this guy. Here in the US, that would be against the law.
Thallium, you are so smart, you have so much going for you. This guy is a MAJOR LOSER!!!!!!!! Not to mention SCARY.
I don't ususally give relationship advice, but this is so serious, I will make an exception. DROP HIM NOW!! This is NOT the person for you.
Please listen to me. I have a very bad feeling about this guy.
And there was me trying to be subtle :biggrin:
And to the other guys I dont see what your problem is, I would do the same as Chroot would. Unfortunately I'm not in the position where girls throw themselves at me :mad: :frown:
Thallium
May6-04, 09:43 AM
I am not letting him go. We have talked and reunited in many ways. The points which we disagree on, I hardly know anything about and I cannot base my decision on ignorance. I would probably regret it. I am thinking deeply and I no longer believe he is a liar as I used to. He has convinced me. He would not be as intelligent as he is if he was lying. It is my mind that is the problem. My mental state. I am thinking of perhaps contacting a psychologist. That is MY idea.
I am thinking deeply and I no longer believe he is a liar as I used to. He has convinced me.
You'll find out that people don't change a whole lot (unless influenced by rapid hormone changes). If somebody is a cheater when you meet them, they will always cheat. If they lie, they will always lie.
adrenaline
May6-04, 11:10 AM
i agree with evo
Thallium
May6-04, 11:33 AM
You'll find out that people don't change a whole lot (unless influenced by rapid hormone changes). If somebody is a cheater when you meet them, they will always cheat. If they lie, they will always lie.
But he has never lied to me. I realized that today when we talked. I cannot think that he is manipulating me with every word he says. What would that say about ME? It was all in my head. I conceived all of this about the darn university. The way he spoke about was to me credible. Now I do not know about the "Jews-are-children-of-Satan"-theory. I will have to do some research.
The_Professional
May6-04, 12:39 PM
Now I do not know about the "Jews-are-children-of-Satan"-theory. I will have to do some research.
That doesn't even need research. They're not, and neither is any race.
Jenn_ucsb
May6-04, 07:57 PM
Geez, honey, you're 18, go find someone in your age bracket (try and keep 'em under 25) that respects you and treats you well. I think your idea about seeking a psychologist is a good one. They would be a great resource for you to be able to talk about this relationship, because it sounds exploitive and manipulative.
Hi Thallium,
I don't really know what to say here, except perhaps from what you have written, the man you love is able to put a spin on everything and brainwash you. He is able to do so because 1. he is much older and more experienced, intelligent and articulate than you are and 2. you are swayed (if not blinded) by your desperate love for him. I am not trying to divorce you from him, because I know nobody can, you will have to think for yourself and come to your own decision.
Seeing a psychiatrist is a good idea, so is keeping your distance from him so that you can think for yourself. Still your thought and ask yourself, if you could start your life all over again before you met him, would you date a guy like him?
All of us on the forum are nice people and can offer you both men's and women's perspectives, you are amongst friends.
i agree with evo
I do, too.
Yes, he appears to be very aggressive. Fights, jail sentences, custody, fines,
ex-member of the Ku Klux Klan, and before he "received" that letter, I joked about not wanting to be with him if he was not well-educated and had completed his degree in engineering. Perhaps he took this seriously. I am happy with him as he is, and he seemed to understand that, but... I am still anxious. There are also other reasons for me being unsure: He and I share different opinion on Jews. He believes they are the Children of Satan(this is getting very personal), I DON'T. No people are the childran of Satan. We do not share the same views. He does not complain to me about my views, but he does not know this particular opinion of mine.
Well, I get so upset when teling about this. Please, no comments on my views relating to God and Jews, no criticism: I am asking for advice, not derision.
All of these bad signals are part of my displeasefulness with our relationship. Should I break up with him? I am closing in on that thought. I deserve something better than such a hostile and hateful man. I cannot stand it, but at the same time I love him. But I am not convinced that I have ever been in love with him.
Suddenly this turned into an enormously personal matter, but I have to air my grievance! Forgive me if I insult anyone!
This guy comes with a lot of ugly baggage. Do you really want to associate with him for the rest of your life? You said he is aggressive, and is a fighter has he ever hit you? Do you think he has this potential? Why isn't he with the mother of his child (you mentioned custody)? What was the jailtime for? Does he pay child support? Has he skipped out on this responsibility (is that what the fine was for)?
If you love each other, none of this matters. You can work through the problems. You said you love him, but does he love you?
Thallium
May7-04, 10:09 AM
No, I do not wish to associate with such a man for the rest of my life. If I could rewind tme, I would definitely date someone different. Another thing is that I know another man who I also have feelings for. He is safe, clean and SO nice! And INTELLIGENT too! He is 25 but I am completely fine with that. I like men at that age and it is not so sad to think about... Compared to this other ex-Ku-Klux-Klan man who is 19 years older than me. Think about it, when I am 40, he is 60!! Gosh, what am I thinking.
But beg your pardon, Polly! "Much more intelligent than you are"? Oh, thanks a lot! I am sure you did not mean to put it that way, though.. Well, he is intelligent and more experienced, but I do not believe in the experience-concept. If you know yourself, you have experience enough. And I know myself.
And you guys know what? This other guy that I am so fond of.. He makes me feel comfortable. The KKK-man does not. He just frightens me.
I would never believe that the Jews are the children of Satan. No one is. That hostile view of his makes me depressed because I do not have such prejudgements against others. I love Jews! They deserve far more respect than what they have received to this date. That is another discussion..
I have changed my mind. I deserve something better and I see the possibility of him manipulating me. I am not in love with him. Perhaps it was only desire though I am not the shallow type. And I do not need to go to a psychologist. I have sorted this out by myself.
And what a relief!!!!! Thank you all for your respons! It means very much to me and you made me think of certain crucial things that never crossed my mind. Thank you again! It will hurt a bit, but I will get over it. There is someone else waiting for me. Someone much better.
Thallium
May7-04, 10:12 AM
This guy comes with a lot of ugly baggage. Do you really want to associate with him for the rest of your life? You said he is aggressive, and is a fighter has he ever hit you? Do you think he has this potential? Why isn't he with the mother of his child (you mentioned custody)? What was the jailtime for? Does he pay child support? Has he skipped out on this responsibility (is that what the fine was for)?
If you love each other, none of this matters. You can work through the problems. You said you love him, but does he love you?
No. He has never hit me, does not pay child support, he has no children, he was fined for having bought a care that was stolen and fined several times for fighting. I do not think he has the potential to hit me. He adores me, he says, and he would never hit a woman. Klansmen have great respect for their women so I believe in that. But as you see in my previous post, I have made ut my mind. I can fish something better from the ponds of the world! :)
No, I do not wish to associate with such a man for the rest of my life. If I could rewind tme, I would definitely date someone different. Another thing is that I know another man who I also have feelings for. He is safe, clean and SO nice! And INTELLIGENT too! He is 25 but I am completely fine with that. I like men at that age and it is not so sad to think about... Compared to this other ex-Ku-Klux-Klan man who is 19 years older than me. Think about it, when I am 40, he is 60!! Gosh, what am I thinking.
But beg your pardon, Polly! "Much more intelligent than you are"? Oh, thanks a lot! I am sure you did not mean to put it that way, though.. Well, he is intelligent and more experienced, but I do not believe in the experience-concept. If you know yourself, you have experience enough. And I know myself.
And you guys know what? This other guy that I am so fond of.. He makes me feel comfortable. The KKK-man does not. He just frightens me.
I would never believe that the Jews are the children of Satan. No one is. That hostile view of his makes me depressed because I do not have such prejudgements against others. I love Jews! They deserve far more respect than what they have received to this date. That is another discussion..
I have changed my mind. I deserve something better and I see the possibility of him manipulating me. I am not in love with him. Perhaps it was only desire though I am not the shallow type. And I do not need to go to a psychologist. I have sorted this out by myself.
And what a relief!!!!! Thank you all for your respons! It means very much to me and you made me think of certain crucial things that never crossed my mind. Thank you again! It will hurt a bit, but I will get over it. There is someone else waiting for me. Someone much better.
Wise choice.
how much is a ticket to Norway??? if you are single i better get packing!!!
Thallium
May8-04, 09:19 AM
Jimmy!?!? Wow, that is a compliment. I am single again now, yes. But... do you like me, Jimmy? :)
If there were a blushing smiley then I would use about a million. I dunno. You seem cool, bout my age, and besides all girls from your part of the world are hot.
Jenn_ucsb
May8-04, 02:35 PM
Aww, this is so cute...
jimmy p, I think you've been watching too much Full House.
like, duh!! ... actually, what is full house?? we dont get it over here in Blighty
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0092359/
Thallium
May8-04, 04:05 PM
That was sweet Jimmy. But if ALL girls from my part of the world are hot, then you would be looking at everyone else too...? Right? I would prefer a MAN who only glared at me.. :)
:( i dont know any other girls from your part of the world... I am a man anyway.. I'm 19. why do you prefer people glaring at you?? throwback from the Viking period?? *pillaging a village near you* Oh well. Better stick to slaying British people and sacking towns locally.
:smile: I cant believe I have been "e-turned down". I'm not sure if this is the most humiliating experience of my life. :rolleyes: nah, that has to be the time I attempted to jump 8 chairs but hit the first one and crashed spectacularily into a bench. And then got shouted at while I was lying in a painful, crumpled heap. Gotta love school.
Thallium
May9-04, 08:29 AM
Anyways, I know of someone better... ;)
I attempted to jump 8 chairs but hit the first one and crashed spectacularily into a bench. And then got shouted at while I was lying in a painful, crumpled heap. Gotta love school.
So you're THAT guy. :tongue:
mooberrymarz
May9-04, 08:43 AM
He's an ex member of the KKK... wow. that is some scary stuff. I'm glad u realise that u deserve someone better.!! Ure a star thallium. just one question, did he have one of those weird bed sheet things they wear over their heads... just wondering. :redface:
Thallium
May9-04, 04:29 PM
He probably has yes. He has even maintained contact with some of the members there. I think those hoods were pretty sexy.. But black skimasks are far more sexy!
Anyways, I know of someone better... ;)
I'm insulted. :cry: Ah well. If anyone needs me I'll be jumping chairs again.
I think those hoods were pretty sexy.. But black skimasks are far more sexy!
We're going to find you dead in the bottom of a ravine one day. :frown:
- Warren
We're going to find you dead in the bottom of a ravine one day. :frown:
Jeez guy, you are such a downer.
Math Is Hard
May9-04, 06:55 PM
He probably has yes. He has even maintained contact with some of the members there. I think those hoods were pretty sexy.. But black skimasks are far more sexy!
:uhh:
ummm.. you do understand that the KKK has a history of killing people who are outside of the caucasian race or not in line with the Klan's goals, right?
Why would you find that sexy? Are you attracted to violent men?
Anyway, I don't know why you would tie yourself down with any kind of a boyfriend right now. You have a lot of goals to accomplish and that's going to take a lot of work. If you get tied up with a guy, that's time away from your studies. If you get tied up with a loser guy, he's going to drag you down and waste your time. I am not saying you shouldn't be dating, but a big heavy committed relationship is really going to slow you down in finishing your education. You have said in the past that your educational goals are very important to you.
Are you attracted to violent men?
All women are attracted to violent men.
You know that bad boy image girls like? Yeah well those guys are all violent.
All women are attracted to violent men.
You know that bad boy image girls like? Yeah well those guys are all violent.Uhm , no. Only brain dead air heads are attracted to those types. I have NEVER been attracted to a violent or "bad boy" type. I don't think any woman worth getting to know likes those types.
The_Professional
May9-04, 08:59 PM
Let me rephrase what ShawnD said. Women with low self-esteem are attracted to violent, possessive, controlling men. Because they initially misconstrue such behavior as positive masculine traits.
Let me rephrase what ShawnD said. Women with low self-esteem are attracted to violent, possessive, controlling men. Because they initially misconstrue such behavior as positive masculine traits.That I would agree with.
Thallium
May10-04, 10:17 AM
I am NOT attracted to violent men. When I referred to skimasks, I meant for instance the IRA. They are nationalists, fighting for their country. That is sexy. Not thieves who hide behind skimasks when they atack banks and old ladies..
No, I like kind men and the one I have fallen for now happens to be that. I would not like a possessive man who gave me orders and slapped me if I did not obey him. I like MEN! - not beasts...
jimmy p
May10-04, 12:34 PM
The IRA arent nationalists. They are terrorists. The IRA killed my (when i was 4) best friend's dad. Just because he was a British soldier. They shot him on his front door step. In Germany. Now tell me that is fighting for a good cause when you are killing soldiers in a completely different country.
These guys are animals fighting for a stupid cause. If Northern Ireland wants to remain British the Repulicans should let them instead of terrorising them. THAT is not sexy. The Republic is not part of the UK but Northern Ireland is. The Repulicans dont like it so started bombing the place and terrorising the citys. Notice how they got real quiet when the "war on terror" was announced. Not a peep from the IRA nowadays. If they were so keen on fighting for their cause then they would have carried on.
I'm sorry but the first paragraph is personal to myself and my family. That guy was a good family friend.
Thallium
May11-04, 08:39 AM
I am sorry too, but that does not change my point of view. The BRITISH people in Ireland want to remain a part of Great Britain. That land belongs to the IRISH.
Call the IRA whatever you want. The word terrorist is always associated with something bad to most people - not me. What needs to be done, needs to be done. They are nationalists as well.
Not a peep from the IRA nowadays no, because most of the factions have declared ceasefire. But two of them have not and are still active.
mooberrymarz
May11-04, 12:33 PM
I guess jimmy has a valid reason for calling them terrorists, same as with u.. they could be considered as nationalists. thats why I love freedom of expression......................... :smile: As a South African, I can relate to their (IRA) struggle for liberation, its admirable, however the loss of innocent life should never be justified wotever the cause. I firmly believe that! Nelson mandela brought our country to freedom without firing a bullet, and I think we can all learn from him. the thing about freedom is that in most cases it is certainly never free.. and sometimes some people are willing to pay high prices for it at someone elses cost. its a sad thing really.
jimmy p
May11-04, 03:24 PM
Actually the are a terrorist organisation. Anyone who deliberately kills civilians is a terrorist. The British people in Ireland are the people from Northern Ireland. The republicans in NI are the ones that cause the hassle. The land of Scotland belongs to the Scottish, the land of England belongs to the English and likewise with Wales... what is your point?
If I decided that I didnt want to be part of the UK anymore and wanted an independent England, and started killing random civilians and bombing buildings am I a terrorist or a nationalist?? They are EXTREMISTS but not religious extremists. The rest of the RoI are happy to live as an independent country, it is just the extremists that think all of Ireland should be Irish.
Thallium
May11-04, 03:32 PM
NI was once a part of Ireland for the Irish people, but then it was invaded, exploited and occupied by the English. The English are so proud they will not give it back and the Irish want them out of their territory.
You miss the point with the killing. If you kill for your country, you may be considered a nationalist. You love your country. The ones that killed the father of your friend did this because he was an enemy...
I would kill for what was mine, I would kill to protect my country and what belongs to me and my people.
Yep, I agree with Jimmy. They're nothing more than terrorists.
Thallium, killing civilians for your country does not make you nationalist; it makes you either a war criminal or a terrorist.
jimmy p
May11-04, 03:40 PM
I have a little more to say...
Using your same logic the palestinian suicide bombers who kill innocents in Israel are sexy, the people killing soldiers in Iraq are sexy, if the native peoples of America rose up and started killing people presumably that would be sexy too, The IRA use violence and fear to try spread their own political agenda, which is the definition of a terrorist, terms like 'nationalist' and 'freedom fighters' are just sugar coats for violent, dangerous and amoral individuals who kill innocents for a cause that is wrong, Northern Ireland is British by vote of the Irish people, by definition they become British Citizens. It's not a struggle for freedom because they're not being oppressed. They might claim it but the only oppression in Northern Ireland comes from these terrorists fighting for and against British sovereignty, its not oppression on the part of the British government.
The IRA are terrorists, they've been responsible for the deaths of over 3000 people since 1962 (the IRA and other associated terror groups). They're comparable to Al Qaeda in terms of the number of people they've killed.
Would you say Osama Bin Laden is sexy?
jimmy p
May11-04, 03:50 PM
besides its not the English... You must watch too many Mel Gibson movies....
Thallium
May11-04, 03:58 PM
Why do you for care replying? Terrorists - call them whatever you want. Humans are not only "happy-hippie-hoorayh-let's-solve-the-problem-with-apeaceful-solution" - especially not when it does not satisfy both parts.
No, bin Laden is not sexy.
Now, what about the UV, the LVF and the UDA... They have killed people too. Go to www.irishresistancebooks.com, click on "The Guineapigs" and read chapter 3,4 and 5. See how the loyalists treated "civilians" and innocent people.
Civilians is an abused term for gaining compassion. This man was an enemy, and a civilian. But, a "civilian" could be any man on earth. There are no such things as non-civilians.
jimmy p
May11-04, 04:16 PM
Why should I care for replying?? You are slandering my country...
Yes I know theres more then just the IRA, did I mention that I LIVE in Britain? The ULA, the IRA, the pIRA and all the others are all terrorists. So what your saying is that terrorism is 'natural?' and therefore acceptable? I'm sure the families of the 9/11 victims will rest easy at night knowing that.
Any loss of innocent life is a crime, period, especially if its done for the sake of a minority who DONT represent the majority view of the people in Northern Ireland.
Things in Northern Ireland are bad, people in some areas are raised simply to hate others because they were born in the wrong street, intimidation, fighting, vandalism and murder are all too frequent, but generally it doesnt even make the British papers, let alone the Norwegian ones, kids going to school get taunted, abused and harrased by adults to such an extent that they need a police escort. But that is ok i suppose?
I notice your objection to the word 'civilian' would you perhaps care to tell me of another word for a normal person going about their life, the kind of person generally caught in their terrorist actions. In fact in militarilistic terms, a civilian is a non-military personnel. Terrorist organisations usually have military aspects so that I think that is a good enough term for the general populace.
Im not saying Loyalists are better then Republicans, they're all equally bad. I'm just opposing your view that racist murderers are sexy.
(Disclaimer: I don't make any claims that the following statements do or do not apply to the IRA)
The whole "fight for your freedom" thing means fighting your oppressors, and does not mean killing people who would otherwise be entirely uninvolved with your struggle in hopes of terrorizing them into forcing those who are involved in the struggle to cave.
Thallium
May12-04, 12:47 PM
I never said that racist murderers are sexy. The outfit that these men use is sexy, not the KKK's themselves.
Your friend's father was a soldier and therefore not a civilian, according to the "militaristic terms" oyu mentioned. That is why we are not talking about killing a civilian. But the IRA should be fighting directly against the other paramilitaries, not casual by-passers and people who are not involved, I agree, and I do not feel comfortable when hearing of killings of not-involved persons. Most of those who have been abducted, killed etc have been involved in some way, either they were tell-taling, spying, killing people in the IRA or opposing them in a violent way. Some of them were fanatics, some were loyalists/unionists.
"Any loss of innocent life is a crime, period, especially if its done for the sake of a minority who DONT represent the majority view of the people in Northern Ireland."
Whether taking someone's life is a crime or not depends on how you define 'crime'. Your understanding of a crime may not be another's understanding of crime.
A crime is something that is punishable by law. The IRA kill people within British jurisdiction; therefore, they follow British laws. I might be wrong on this but I heard that killing people is illegal in Britain :wink:.
jimmy p
May12-04, 01:17 PM
and in most countries i would assume.
My friends father aside. That was not what I was talking about. He was just one victim, but there are many other innocents which i was referring to.
I am glad we are starting to agree on things though, i would hate to make an enemy here :biggrin:
Thallium
May13-04, 10:53 AM
Yes the same to you, jimmy. I do not over my dead body want to make enemies in here. I like you and IRA shall not get in the way. I accept your opinion. It is always nice with different opinions so that one is not blinded by one's own.
jimmy p
May13-04, 11:00 AM
Yeah, I agree. :smile:
I still have memories of the things we had to do in Germany. Every time we used the car we had to check that there were no bombs under it, I had to go to school in an military base because that was the safest place for children of soldiers. I also had to be able to lie convincingly in German if people asked what my dad's job was. No-one was allowed to know he was in the Army in case an IRA member was listening.
Thallium
May14-04, 10:49 AM
Yes, it is truly a dirty war. The one part is no less guilty than the other. Still, I hold on to my stand that Northern Ireland should be part of Ireland and not occupied by British.
My condoles
jimmy p
May14-04, 06:25 PM
lol, the people of NI voted it...
Thallium
May15-04, 09:21 AM
But the number of supporters has decreased...
jimmy p
May15-04, 06:49 PM
but the majority still want to be British...
Thallium
May16-04, 01:19 PM
..but the number of supporters has decreased...
HAHAHAHAH!! We will keep going like this forever... :D
It doesn't matter how low support is. Majority still rules; that's how a referendum works. If people started to riot every time a vote didn't go their way, every democratic nation in the world would be in big trouble.
jimmy p
May16-04, 04:28 PM
and as me and ShawnD are in agreement, as he stated, majority rules. Now bow down and accept your fate HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :devil: :devil:
Thallium
May18-04, 10:06 AM
Oh, **** that.
jimmy p
May18-04, 01:28 PM
LOL!!! :biggrin: ok!!
Thallium
May19-04, 03:51 PM
That is what we call diplomacy.. :P
jimmy p
May19-04, 06:25 PM
mental note: dont piss of Norway
Thallium
May20-04, 10:51 AM
Oh, and what is that supposed to mean?
jimmy p
May20-04, 01:43 PM
Well, if that is how you are diplomatic, I would hate to see you guys being UNdiplomatic! :biggrin:
Thallium
May20-04, 01:53 PM
Ah! Case closed. Court adjourned.
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