Deriving Energy in Special Relativity: The Principle of Extremal Aging

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of energy in Special Relativity as presented in Taylor and Wheeler's "Exploring Black Holes," specifically focusing on the equation \(\frac{t}{\tau} = \frac{E}{m}\), where \(\tau\) is proper time, \(t\) is frame time, \(E\) is energy, and \(m\) is mass. Participants are exploring the connection between the Principle of Extremal Aging and the derivation of this equation.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes the equation \(\frac{t}{\tau} = \frac{E}{m}\) and seeks clarification on how \(E/m\) is derived as a constant of motion.
  • Another participant explains that \(t\) is the time-component of the position 4-vector with magnitude \(\tau\), and that \(E\) is the time-component of the momentum 4-vector with magnitude \(m\).
  • A third participant expresses confusion regarding the relationship between the 4-vector concepts and the \(E/m\) ratio, requesting further detail.
  • A later reply indicates that since \(t = \gamma \tau\) and \(E = \gamma m\), it follows that \(\frac{t}{\tau} = \gamma = \frac{E}{m}\).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants appear to have varying levels of understanding regarding the derivation and implications of the equation, with some expressing confusion and seeking clarification. No consensus is reached on the clarity of the explanation provided.

Contextual Notes

Some participants may be missing connections between the 4-vector formalism and the implications for energy and mass, indicating potential gaps in understanding or assumptions that have not been fully articulated.

H-bar None
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I'm reading Taylor and Wheeler's, Exploring Black Holes.

I was doing okay until I reached their derivation of energy in Special Relativity.

They arrived at this equation:

[tex]\frac{t}{\tau} = \frac{E}{m}[/tex]

Tau is proper time, t is the frame time, E is energy and m is mass.

The authors used the Principle of Extremal Aging to derive the equation. How did they arrive at E/m as a constant of motion?
 
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H-bar None said:
They arrived at this equation:

[tex]\frac{t}{\tau} = \frac{E}{m}[/tex]

Tau is proper time, t is the frame time, E is energy and m is mass.

t is the time-component of the position 4-vector with magnitude [tex]\tau[/tex].
[tex]t=\gamma \tau[/tex]

E is the time-component of the momentum 4-vector with magnitude [tex]m[/tex].
[tex]E=\gamma m[/tex]
 
:confused:

I sort of understand the 4-vector part. How does that relate to "E/m"?
I'm going to do some more reading check back with you later on in life.

Could go into a litte more detail, maybe I'm missing something.
Thanks for the response.
 
Since [tex]t=\gamma \tau[/tex], we have [tex]\frac{t}{\tau}=\gamma[/tex].
Since [tex]E=\gamma m[/tex], we have [tex]\frac{E}{m}=\gamma[/tex].

Thus, [tex]\frac{t}{\tau}=\gamma=\frac{E}{m}[/tex].
 

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