Friction problem that's really bugging me

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a crate being dragged across a floor with a rope inclined at an angle, focusing on the forces of friction and tension. It is situated within the context of mechanics, specifically dealing with static friction and force components.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the calculation of the normal force and its relationship to the tension in the rope. There is confusion regarding how to account for the vertical component of the tension when determining the normal force and frictional force.

Discussion Status

The discussion has progressed with participants offering guidance on calculating the vertical and horizontal components of the tension. Some participants express uncertainty about how to proceed without knowing certain values, while others suggest methods to derive the necessary components.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the problem does not provide the tension in the rope initially, leading to complications in calculating the normal force and frictional force. There is an acknowledgment of the relationship between the components of tension and the forces acting on the crate.

hyperglitter
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A man drags a 150-lb crate across a floor by pulling on a rope inclined 15 degrees above the horizontal. a) If the coefficient of static friction is 0.50, what tension in the rope is required to start the crate moving?
The answer is supposedly 68 lb.
I start by assuming the normal force = weight, so Fn = 150 lb. The force of friction operating against the direction of motion is Ff = Fn*coefficient of static friction, which is at its maximum.
So 150*.5 = 75 lb = Ff

Now the x component of the force required to move the crate should be equal to the frictional force (Ff). So Cos 15 = 75/Frope, and Frope turns out to be 77.65 lb. This is wrong, but oddly it is 9.8 off from the correct answer (though I realize this is irrelevant since the problem is in lbs). What am I doing wrong? Thanks :smile:
 
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Nice start but the normal force is not 150 lb. The tension has a vertical component.
 
I suspected that, but have no clue how to find it.. it seems like in order to solve for it, I need to find the frictional force, but the frictional force is calculated using the normal force, so I don't know where to start. :(
 
Sure you do! You know what the tension is and you calculated its horizontal component so surely you can also calculate the vertical component.
 
Er, but the only reason I know the tension is 68 lb is because I checked the answer, it's not given at the start of the problem. And I can't calculate the normal force since I don't know the vertical component, and since I don't know the normal force I can't calculate the frictional force, and thus the horizontal component. Obviously I'm missing something simple, but I'm not sure what. :(
 
If T is the tension in the rope then the horizontal component is [itex]T \cos \theta[/itex] where [itex]\theta[/itex] is the angle with respect to the horizontal. Therefore, the vertical component will be ...??
 
I knew Tsintheta was the vertical component, I was just afraid to leave the normal force as 150 - Fropesin15 and try to solve from there. Anyway, I plugged it in and got the right answer. Thanks a lot :)
 
You're welcome!
 

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