A trick to solve functional integraltion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around approaches to solving functional integrals in quantum field theory, particularly focusing on a proposed formula that resembles the Bernoulli formula for functionals. Participants explore the implications and validity of this formula, as well as the definitions and interpretations of functional derivatives.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that functional integrals are generally unsolvable except through semiclassical methods, proposing a formula involving functional derivatives as a potential approach.
  • Another participant requests a reference for the proposed expansion formula and discusses the definition of functional derivatives, questioning the meaning of the term \(\phi^n\) in the context of functionals.
  • A participant points out the need for clarity regarding the path integration on the left-hand side of the proposed formula, questioning how it relates to the right-hand side.
  • Another participant introduces the idea of considering functional integration as the inverse of the functional derivative, presenting a series expansion for the operator based on this perspective.
  • Concerns are raised about the validity of the assumptions underlying the proposed equations and series expansions, particularly regarding their applicability to functionals.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the validity and interpretation of the proposed formula and its components. There is no consensus on the correctness of the approaches discussed, and multiple competing interpretations remain present.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential ambiguities in definitions and interpretations of functional derivatives and the implications of the proposed formula. The discussion reflects a range of assumptions and conditions that may affect the validity of the claims made.

eljose
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we know that the functional integrals are important in quantum field theory,but we have the problem that except for the semiclassical approach,they can not be solved anyway..but if we used the formula:.
[tex]\int{d[\phi]F[\phi]=\sum_{n=1}^{\infty}(-1)^{n}\phi^n{D^{n}F[\phi]}[/tex]
where D is the functional derivative [tex]D=\delta/\delta{\phi}[/tex]
this is the Bernoulli formula for the functional ,we could obtain an approach to the functional integral,wher [tex]\phi=\int{\phi}d^4x[/tex]
 
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Can you tell me the reference for this expansion formula for functional, because if I take the definition of the first functional derivative i read : [tex]D_\eta[\phi]=\lim_{\epsilon\rightarrow 0}\frac{F[\phi+\epsilon\eta]-F[\phi]}{\epsilon}[/tex]..this is the functional derivative of F in the "direction" [tex]\eta[/tex]..since a functional is a function which has starting elements that are themself functions (functions can build a more than continuus infinite dimensional space)...this leads to the first order approximation : [tex]F[\phi+\epsilon\eta]\approx F[\phi]+\epsilon D_\eta[\phi][/tex]...the usual derivative is to put [tex]\eta(x)=\delta(x-y)[/tex] and is written D_{\eta(x)=\delta(x-y)}F[\phi]=\frac{\delta F}{\delta\phi}[/tex].
Hence I get the expansion : [tex]F[\phi+\epsilon\eta]=\sum_{n=0}^\infty \frac{\epsilon^n}{n!}D_\eta F[\phi][/tex]
In you expansion it is for me not clear what [tex]\phi^n[/tex] means, since phi is a function, there exist different meaning : [tex]\phi(x)^n=\phi(x)\ldots\phi(x)\textrm{ and } \phi^n(x)=\phi(\cdots\phi(x)\cdots)[/tex]
 
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eljose said:
we know that the functional integrals are important in quantum field theory,but we have the problem that except for the semiclassical approach,they can not be solved anyway..but if we used the formula:.
[tex]\int{d[\phi]F[\phi]=\sum_{n=1}^{\infty}(-1)^{n}\phi^n{D^{n}F[\phi]}[/tex]
where D is the functional derivative [tex]D=\delta/\delta{\phi}[/tex]
this is the Bernoulli formula for the functional ,we could obtain an approach to the functional integral,wher [tex]\phi=\int{\phi}d^4x[/tex]

LHS is a path integration over [tex]\phi[/tex]. How did you drop that path on RHS i.e. [tex]\int{d[\phi][/tex] ?
 
If we consider the functional integration as the inverse of functional derivative let be [tex]G=\delta/\delta{\phi}[/tex] then we have that the solution to the functional equation:

[tex]F[\phi]+\phi{DF[\phi]}=e^{iS[\phi]/\hbar}[/tex] (1)

is [tex]F[\phi]=(1/\phi)\int{D[\phi]e^{iS/\hbar}[/tex]

but the differential equation can be solve by iterations to get the series..

[tex]F[\phi]=\sum_{n=0}^{\infty}\phi^{n}G^{n}e^{iS/\hbar}[/tex]

Unless of course is not true that for functionals...

[tex]G\int{D[\phi]e^{iS/\hbar}=e^{iS/\hbar}[/tex]

so if we consider the functional integration as the inverse of functional derivative..we can construct a series expansion for the operator D^{-1}, in fact it is supposed that:

[tex]D[\phi]=Lim{j\rightarrow\infty}\Product{dx1.dx2.dx3...dxj}[/tex]
 
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