
#1
Apr2512, 10:37 PM

P: 17

Good evening. I have been reading that the repulsion generated by the Pauli exclusion principle barely prevents neutrons in neutron stars from occupying the same quantum states (after all, they are fermions). However, the principle seems to be violated in a black hole, given that fermions are compressed to the point where everything is in the same place (the singularity). For example, what happens to a proton as it approaches the singularity? I am wondering if the exclusion principle is violated in black holes. The alternative would be that at some point, matter gets turned back into energy (given that matter and energy are equivalent, it seems plausible); the Pauli exclusion principle would no longer apply because the fermions would have turned into energy, thus the principle would not be violated. What are your thoughts on this?
Thank you in advance. 



#2
Apr2612, 12:03 AM

P: 887

everything is energy (and particles). every particle obeys either boseeinstein or fermidirac statistics. i think you mean that it turns into a boson.




#3
Apr2612, 12:11 AM

Sci Advisor
PF Gold
P: 9,185

It is not known if another barrier exists past the neutron degeneracy limit. Some scientists suspect there is also a quark degenercy limit. A black hole may represent a special case bounded only by planck scale physics.




#4
Apr2612, 03:58 PM

PF Gold
P: 11,057

Pauli Exclusion Principle in Black Holes. 



#5
Apr2712, 12:47 AM

P: 70

There is no violation.
Time dilation, as predicted by Einstein's theory of general relativity, has prevented any such violation from occurring. 



#6
Apr2712, 12:51 AM

PF Gold
P: 11,057





#7
Apr2712, 12:55 AM

P: 70





#8
Apr2712, 07:44 AM

P: 23

how can electrons and protons combine to form a neutron ?
when beta minus decay occurs then a neutron interacts with a wboson which has the ability to change the quarks " flavor" , making the neutron`s two down quarks to two up quarks and the one up quark to a down quark, and then the W boson "deacays" to an electron and an antineutrino , how can this go the other way around ? 



#9
Apr2712, 08:35 AM

P: 317

[tex]u \rightarrow d + W^+[/tex] where the [itex]W^+[/itex] and electron can then "decay" into the neutrino. Clearly the up > down decay is not energetically favored and therefore normally suppressed, but if your electron, say, has a lot of kinetic energy then that can be used up. 



#10
Apr2812, 12:26 AM

P: 514

The Pauli exclusion principle is not violated. Instead, the material's mass density increases and increases and increases.
To a first approximation, that principle states that there is only one particle inside a box with its size being the particle's de Broglie wavelength. Strictly speaking, there are as many as there are spin states, but electrons and nucleons both have 2 spin states. A particle's de Broglie wavelength is related to its momentum by wl = h/p. 



#11
May312, 04:37 AM

P: 23

and how can the change of the "flavor" of the quark occur ? do you need to have a w boson to do so to begin with ? 



#12
May312, 07:15 PM

P: 6,863

What happens as you increase gravitational force is that the number of energy states increases so that the degeneracy is lifted. 


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