Register to reply

Primes, pigeon holes, modular arithmetic

by HmBe
Tags: arithmetic, holes, modular, pigeon, primes
Share this thread:
HmBe
#1
Nov27-12, 09:30 AM
P: 45
1. The problem statement, all variables and given/known data




3. The attempt at a solution

Don't have a clue how to even start this one, sorry.
Phys.Org News Partner Science news on Phys.org
Apple to unveil 'iWatch' on September 9
NASA deep-space rocket, SLS, to launch in 2018
Study examines 13,000-year-old nanodiamonds from multiple locations across three continents
Zondrina
#2
Nov27-12, 09:41 AM
P: 1,591
I don't have much time to help with this one. Do you recall what the pigeonhole principle states?

The n elements of a set get mapped to n-1 elements of another set, so no matter what, there are elements ai and aj which get mapped to the same element or the same 'hole'.
HmBe
#3
Nov27-12, 09:53 AM
P: 45
Yeah I'm happy with the pigeon hole principle, although I can't quite see how it applies as a can be any natural number or 0, so surely the size of set A is infinite?

Michael Redei
#4
Nov27-12, 10:14 AM
P: 181
Primes, pigeon holes, modular arithmetic

Quote Quote by HmBe View Post
Yeah I'm happy with the pigeon hole principle, although I can't quite see how it applies as a can be any natural number or 0, so surely the size of set A is infinite?
That can't be meant, because the pigeonhole principle can only be used if ##\mathcal A## is finite. So ##0\leq a,b<\sqrt p## probable means ##(0\leq a<\sqrt p)## and ##(0\leq b<\sqrt p)##. This would give you ##|\mathcal A| < (\sqrt p+1)^2 = p+2\sqrt p+1##.

Now I'd look at the function ##f(x,y)=x^2+2y^2## for all pairs ##(x,y)\in\mathcal A##.
HmBe
#5
Nov27-12, 08:38 PM
P: 45
Ah right yeah I thought they were too separate inequalities which really messed me up. Quite simple now.

Got down to this..

(b-b')^2 + 2(a-a')^2 = pk

for some integer k.

I'm having a little struggle getting rid of the k (so to speak).

a, b, a', b' are all < sqrt(p)

so

(b-b')^2 + 2(a-a')^2 < 3p

so k < 3

if k = 1 we're fine, no worries.

but what about the k = 2 case? I feel like I should return to the x^2 = -2 (mod p) to get some fact about p I could use...?

Thanks for the help.


Register to reply

Related Discussions
Modular arithmetic Calculus & Beyond Homework 3
Modular arithmetic Calculus & Beyond Homework 2
Modular arithmetic Linear & Abstract Algebra 11
Modular Arithmetic Calculus & Beyond Homework 2
Help: modular arithmetic General Math 17