Primes, pigeon holes, modular arithmetic

In summary, the conversation discusses the application of the pigeonhole principle in solving a problem involving a set of elements. It is noted that the size of the set must be finite for the principle to be used. The participants also mention using a function to find a solution and discuss different cases for the integer k. The conversation ends with the suggestion to revisit a previous equation to find a useful fact about p.
  • #1
HmBe
45
0

Homework Statement



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The Attempt at a Solution



Don't have a clue how to even start this one, sorry.
 
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  • #2
I don't have much time to help with this one. Do you recall what the pigeonhole principle states?

The n elements of a set get mapped to n-1 elements of another set, so no matter what, there are elements ai and aj which get mapped to the same element or the same 'hole'.
 
  • #3
Yeah I'm happy with the pigeon hole principle, although I can't quite see how it applies as a can be any natural number or 0, so surely the size of set A is infinite?
 
  • #4
HmBe said:
Yeah I'm happy with the pigeon hole principle, although I can't quite see how it applies as a can be any natural number or 0, so surely the size of set A is infinite?

That can't be meant, because the pigeonhole principle can only be used if ##\mathcal A## is finite. So ##0\leq a,b<\sqrt p## probable means ##(0\leq a<\sqrt p)## and ##(0\leq b<\sqrt p)##. This would give you ##|\mathcal A| < (\sqrt p+1)^2 = p+2\sqrt p+1##.

Now I'd look at the function ##f(x,y)=x^2+2y^2## for all pairs ##(x,y)\in\mathcal A##.
 
  • #5
Ah right yeah I thought they were too separate inequalities which really messed me up. Quite simple now.

Got down to this..

(b-b')^2 + 2(a-a')^2 = pk

for some integer k.

I'm having a little struggle getting rid of the k (so to speak).

a, b, a', b' are all < sqrt(p)

so

(b-b')^2 + 2(a-a')^2 < 3p

so k < 3

if k = 1 we're fine, no worries.

but what about the k = 2 case? I feel like I should return to the x^2 = -2 (mod p) to get some fact about p I could use...?

Thanks for the help.
 

What are prime numbers and why are they important in mathematics?

Prime numbers are positive integers that have exactly two divisors, 1 and itself. They cannot be divided evenly by any other number. Prime numbers are important in mathematics because they are the building blocks of all other numbers, and they have many applications in number theory, cryptography, and computer science.

What is the pigeonhole principle and how is it used in mathematics?

The pigeonhole principle states that if there are more objects than there are spaces to put them in, at least one space must contain more than one object. It is used in mathematics to prove the existence or non-existence of solutions to certain problems, and to show that certain patterns or arrangements are inevitable.

How is modular arithmetic used in real-world applications?

Modular arithmetic is used in cryptography, computer science, and music theory, among other fields. In cryptography, it is used to encrypt and decrypt messages, while in computer science, it is used to optimize algorithms and data structures. In music theory, it is used to analyze and create musical scales and chords.

What is the difference between a prime number and a composite number?

A prime number is a positive integer that has exactly two divisors, 1 and itself. A composite number is a positive integer that has more than two divisors. In other words, a composite number can be divided evenly by at least one number other than 1 and itself.

What is the relationship between prime numbers and modular arithmetic?

There are several relationships between prime numbers and modular arithmetic. For example, in modular arithmetic, the set of integers modulo a prime number forms a finite field, which has many interesting properties. Additionally, modular arithmetic can be used to find the last digit of a large power of a prime number, as well as to generate prime numbers using certain algorithms.

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