Numbers & Constants: Planck, Boltzman & Universal Gas

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the significance and understanding of various physical constants, specifically Planck's constants, Boltzmann's constant, and the Universal Gas constant. Participants explore their definitions, relationships, and implications in physics and thermodynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire about the purpose and meaning of Planck's constants and Boltzmann's constant, suggesting a need for clarity on their roles in physics.
  • One participant explains that Planck's quantities are derived from the Planck constant, which indicates the smallest units of energy, and emphasizes the importance of units when discussing constants.
  • A participant provides the numerical value of Planck's constant as 6.626 x 10^-34 Joule sec.
  • Another participant asserts that energy is quantized in discrete amounts, linking this to Planck's contributions to quantum physics.
  • A correction is made regarding the relationship between energy and Planck length, highlighting that they are different units.
  • One participant expresses a critical view of constants, suggesting they indicate gaps in knowledge about fundamental concepts like mass and gravity.
  • Another participant counters this view, arguing that constants help define relationships between quantities and are essential in understanding physical interactions.
  • Detailed mathematical relationships involving Boltzmann's constant and the gas constant are presented, emphasizing the necessity of including units in calculations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation and significance of physical constants. While some agree on the importance of units and definitions, others contest the notion that constants indicate gaps in understanding, leading to an unresolved debate.

Contextual Notes

Some statements rely on specific definitions and assumptions about constants and their roles in physics, which may not be universally accepted. The discussion includes various interpretations and mathematical formulations that are not fully resolved.

Mk
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What is the purpose of all the Planck's stuff? Planck's length, Planck's energy. And what is Boltzmann's constant? On my calculator (PCalc 2 for mac) what is the "Universal Gas" (8.31451)?
 
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The various "Planck" quantities are arrived at by manipulation of Planck Constant, which is an indication of the smallest units of energy. (Sort of like Universal pennies)

The numbers are not what you should be looking at when you come upon a "constant". You give the number associated with the Gas constant, it is meaningless without the UNITS.

The gas constant is the R in

PV= nRT, the exact number will depend on the units of the other quantities. To get meaningful results the units must be correct.

Boltzmann constant is related to the Gas constant, it is also found in thermodynamics. Once again learn to examine the units associated with such numbers,they tell you a lot.
 
While on the topic of Planck... I'm new at physics (self-evidently once you read my question), what exactly is the value of Plancks constant? I've read materials that talk about it, but the actual numerical value is what i don't know, any help will be appreciated
 
Planks Constant h=6.626x10^-34 Joule sec.
 
Yes, what dlgoff said is correct. Max Planck was the founder of quantum physics. He said that energy is not continuous, but comes in small, discrete spurts. The energy on one of those spurts = Planck length.
Paden Roder
 
Originally posted by PRodQuanta
The energy on one of those spurts = Planck length.
Energy and length are of different units.

- Warren
 
yep, sorry, he's right, and that is what I intended. i meant energy.
 
Originally posted by Mk
What is the purpose of all the Planck's stuff? Planck's length, Planck's energy. And what is Boltzmann's constant? On my calculator (PCalc 2 for mac) what is the "Universal Gas" (8.31451)?
Any "fundamental constant” is a patch hiding the gaping hole in our knowledge. For example,
gravity force = G*m1*m2/r^2

Presence of G means, that we know nothing about mass, space and gravity. In other cases also.
Any relation should be straight and should not contain any constants.
 
Please ignore the above post, it adds nothing of significance to the conversation.

Boltzmann constant defines the relationship between Temperature and how entropy changes with a changing energy. Bet that helped a lot! Mathematically (which, most likely, will not help much either!)

[tex]\frac 1 \tau = (\frac {\partial \sigma} {\partial U})_{N,V}[/tex]
Where:
[tex]\tau = {Fundamental\ Temperature}[/tex]
[tex]\sigma = {Fundamental\ Entropy}[/tex]
[tex]U = {Energy}[/tex]

The Boltzmann's constant is defined to be

[tex]\tau = k_B T[/tex]
Where T is a temperature scale that you are familiar with (Kelvin, Celsius, Fahrenheit etc) depending on the value of kB

this constant is used extensively in thermodynamics.

R the gas constant is defined to be

R = N0kB

Where N0 is Avogadro's number

N0= 6.022 x 1023
kB=1.38 x 10-18erg/deg
R=8.314 x 107erg/(mole deg)

Always include units with fundamental constants, also to learn about the constant, look at the units. In Physics and chemistry it is essential that you learn to appreciate the physical units attached to a number.
 
Last edited:
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Originally posted by Michael F. Dmitriyev Presence of G means, that we know nothing about mass, space and gravity. In other cases also.
Any relation should be straight and should not contain any constants.


I strongly disagree with this. Whe you find a relation like that of gravity, you have pretty much nailed down: 1. which quantities are relevant for the interaction, 2. how they are involved in the phenomenon under study, and 3. the fact that a combination of them gives you always the same quantity (G in this case).

Also, constants have to do with the definition of the units you choose to use. Some constants in nature are indeed intriguing (maybe 26), but apart from those, they are not "gaps".
 

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