Alcohol and Brain Cells

zoobyshoe

There's a common belief that every glass of alcohol you drink kills a certain number of brain cells.

This is a myth I thought I'd clear up here, one that results from a severe condition sometimes seen in chronic alcoholics called Wernicke-Korsakov's Syndrome.

http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/w...-korsakoff.htm

Symptoms include amnesia, confabulation, attention deficit, disorientation, and vision impairment. The main features of Korsakoff's amnesic syndrome are the impairments in acquiring new information or establishing new memories, and in retrieving previous memories. Although Wernicke's and Korsakoff's may appear to be two different disorders, they are generally considered to be different stages of the same disorder, which is called Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome. Wernicke's encephalopathy represents the "acute" phase of the disorder, and Korsakoff's amnesic syndrome represents the "chronic" phase.

The alcohol, itself, is not killing any neurons. The problem is that chronic drinking causes malabsorption of thiamine, coupled with the fact that many chronic alcoholics eat erratically and poorly. It is thiamine (vitamin B-1) deficiency that causes the neurological problems, not the consumption of alcohol itself. Alcohol doesn't kill brain cells.

Evo

So my propensity to imbibe exorbitant amounts of alcohol is not the cause of my confabulations.

zoobyshoe

Quote by Evo

So my propensity to imbibe exorbitant amounts of alcohol is not the cause of my confabulations.

Your confabulations are the direct result of the exorbitant amounts of alcohol you imbibe. But all those gallons of alcohol you drink every week aren't directly killing brain cells. Your prolonged alcohol abuse, however, coupled with poor nutritional habits, is causing a thiamine deficiency, which in turn damages parts of the brain:

These symptoms are caused by damage to mammillary bodies and other brain regions due to deficiency of thiamine (Vitamin B1). This is most often caused by chronic alcoholism, though other conditions including severe malnutrition have been known to cause it. When Wernicke's encephalopathy accompanies Korsakoff's syndrome, the combined syndrome is called the Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korsakoff's_syndrome

And this, in turn, is causing your confabulations.

My point in posting this is to straighten out the misinformation about alcohol frequently repeated by pot smokers. They seem to believe that any amount of alcohol you drink kills a certain number of neurons. The picture they paint is of alcohol getting into the brain through the bloodstream and physically poisoning and destroying neurons. By this erroneous logic, every beer or glass of wine a person has contributes to a growing neuronal deficit. That, however, is really not the case.

Pythagorean

I chemist or biologist (he worked at a marine research center) once told me that a drink or two a day is good for you, especially if its whine, but a nutritional beer is good too. Lots of friends homebrew around here.

Math Is Hard

Quote by Pythagorean

I chemist or biologist (he worked at a marine research center) once told me that a drink or two a day is good for you, especially if its whine, but a nutritional beer is good too. Lots of friends homebrew around here.

We are doing some research at my university about the effects of whine on brain cells. We are currently recruiting parents of teenagers for the study.

zoobyshoe

Quote by Math Is Hard

We are doing some research at my university about the effects of whine on brain cells. We are currently recruiting parents of teenagers for the study.

Yes, no one should take what I posted as an argument that whine is good for you. The alleged therapeutic benefits of a good whine are apparently still being studied.

Pythagorean

Quote by zoobyshoe

Yes, no one should take what I posted as an argument that whine is good for you. The alleged therapeutic benefits of a good whine are apparently still being studied.

he gave two reasons. One is in the realm of study, the other's a bit more subjective.

1) it increases blood flow and stimulates your circulatory system.

2) it's 'uplifting to the spirit' by which I think he meant psycholgically pleasing (assuming you don't drink too much)

edit: oh my, how embarassing, I just realized you've gone and carried my mispelling to a whole new level and I played right into it. Good show, chaps.

Evo

It's commonly believed that the detrimental effects of whine can be significantly reduced by the consumption of wine.

Zoob, what you posted is very interesting. (getting back on topic)

zoobyshoe

Quote by Evo

It's commonly believed that the detrimental effects of whine can be significantly reduced by the consumption of wine.

We often hear winos whine this, yes.

Zoob, what you posted is very interesting. (getting back on topic)

Yes, here's another, more detailed, rundown:

Heavy drinkers often eat poorly, and the metabolism of alcohol depletes the body’s stores of ‘B’ vitamins. This can lead to a severe deficiency of vitamin B1 (thiamine), causing Wernicke-Korsakov Syndrome. In the Wernicke’s phase of this syndrome, patients become drowsy and unresponsive, and their walking and eye movements become uncoordinated. Wernicke’s is a medical emergency, requiring prompt administration of intravenous thiamine. If not treated in time, patients develop Korsakov’s, exhibiting marked impairment of short term memory. Patients with Korsakov’s may not remember an event that occurred ten minutes earlier; to mask their confusion and make sense of their lives, they sometimes fabricate events (‘confabulation’). Patients with Korsakov’s rarely recover, and frequently require long term care.

http://korcare.co.uk/medical.html

Evo

Quote by zoobyshoe

Yes, here's another, more detailed, rundown:

http://korcare.co.uk/medical.html

Oh no...that's me!

Oh no, that's me!

zoobyshoe

Quote by Evo

Oh no...that's me!

Take some vitamin B-1. (I'll remind you in ten minutes.)

zoobyshoe

Hmmm. This site, with a different spelling of the man's name, has an even better breakdown:

One of the main reasons that alcoholism leads to thiamine deficiency has to do with the high-calorie nature of alcohol. A person with a large alcohol intake often, in essence, substitutes alcohol for other, more nutritive calorie sources. Food intake drops off considerably, and multiple vitamin deficiencies develop. Furthermore, it is believed that alcohol increases the body's requirements for B vitamins, at the same time interfering with the absorption of thiamine from the intestine and impairing the body's ability to store and use thiamine.

The next sentence, though, to my dismay, ressurects the spectre of the idea I'm trying to squelch:

Direct neurotoxic (poisonous damage to the nerves) effects of alcohol may also play some role.

Let it be noted it only says "may".

Anyway, it continues:

Thiamine is involved in a variety of reactions which provide energy to the neurons (nerve cells) of the brain. When thiamine is unavailable, these reactions cannot be carried out, and the important end-products of the reactions are not produced. Furthermore, certain other substances begin to accumulate, and are thought to cause damage to the vulnerable neurons. The area of the brain believed to be responsible for the symptoms of Korsakoff's syndrome is called the diencephalon, specifically the structures called the mamillary bodies and the thalamus.

http://www.healthatoz.com/healthatoz...s_syndrome.jsp

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edit to note: This is my 3000th post!!!!!!!!!!!!!

zoobyshoe

Quote by Evo

Oh no...that's me!

Take some vitamin B-1.

turbo

Evo! Take B1! Remember the Lancer if you need a memory-hook when you get to the drug store.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-1_Lancer

larkspur

Is there enough B-1 in a multi-vitamin or do you need additional supplements of B vitamins?

zoobyshoe

Quote by larkspur

Is there enough B-1 in a multi-vitamin or do you need additional supplements of B vitamins?

From the link in post #9 above:

Wernicke’s is a medical emergency, requiring prompt administration of intravenous thiamine.

selfAdjoint

Quote by zoobyshoe

From the link in post #9 above:

Wernicke’s is a medical emergency, requiring prompt administration of intravenous thiamine.

I think Larkspur was asking about normal daily intake, rather emergency remediation. The answer to that question is that a normal diet should provide the B1 you need, but a B-supplement, if it makes you feel better, couldn't hurt.

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Evo Mentor Blog Entries: 4	So my propensity to imbibe exorbitant amounts of alcohol is not the cause of my confabulations.

Pythagorean Recognitions: Gold Member	Alcohol and Brain Cells I chemist or biologist (he worked at a marine research center) once told me that a drink or two a day is good for you, especially if its whine, but a nutritional beer is good too. Lots of friends homebrew around here.

turbo Recognitions: Gold Member	Evo! Take B1! Remember the Lancer if you need a memory-hook when you get to the drug store. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-1_Lancer

larkspur	Is there enough B-1 in a multi-vitamin or do you need additional supplements of B vitamins?