- #1
easydoesit
- 1
- 0
100 kg of goose feathers or 100 kg of mass and why[?]
Comparing Mass: 100 kg of Goose Feathers vs. 100 kg of Mass - Explained
- Context: High School
- Thread starter easydoesit
- Start date
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- Mass
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Discussion Overview
The discussion revolves around the comparison of mass between 100 kg of goose feathers and 100 kg of another unspecified mass, exploring concepts of mass, weight, and unit systems. Participants delve into the definitions and distinctions between mass and weight, as well as the implications of using different units of measurement.
Discussion Character
- Conceptual clarification
- Debate/contested
- Technical explanation
Main Points Raised
- Some participants assert that 100 kg of any substance has the same mass as 100 kg of another substance.
- There is a distinction made between mass and weight, with some participants emphasizing that mass is measured in kilograms and weight is a force measured in Newtons.
- Some participants argue that using pounds for weight is acceptable, while others insist that pounds should not be used interchangeably for mass and weight.
- One participant mentions that in the American Engineering Standard, the pound can refer to both mass and force, depending on context.
- Another participant discusses the implications of unit conversion and the potential for confusion in calculations, referencing a NASA incident related to unit errors.
- Specific impulse is introduced as a context where both pounds (force) and pounds (mass) are relevant, highlighting the complexity of unit usage in specific applications.
Areas of Agreement / Disagreement
Participants express differing views on the use of pounds for mass and weight, with no consensus reached on the appropriateness of this practice. The distinction between mass and weight is generally acknowledged, but the discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of unit systems.
Contextual Notes
Limitations include varying definitions of weight and mass across different unit systems, as well as the potential for confusion in practical applications, particularly in engineering contexts.
- #2
cookiemonster
- 977
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Kilograms are a measure of mass.
cookiemonster
cookiemonster
- #3
Deeviant
- 285
- 0
Obviously, 100 kg of anything is going to have the same mass as 100kg of anything.
- #4
russ_watters
Mentor
- 23,876
- 11,345
I asked this in another thread: How much does a 150lb man weigh on the moon?
- #5
cookiemonster
- 977
- 0
Earth pounds or Moon pounds?
cookiemonster
cookiemonster
- #6
Deeviant
- 285
- 0
Mass and wieght are two entirely different things.
A 150 lb man would weight about 25 lb on the moon. But he would still mass 150 lb.
A 150 lb man would weight about 25 lb on the moon. But he would still mass 150 lb.
- #7
Adrian Baker
- 378
- 2
Weight is a force and should be measured in Newtons, not in lb.
The SI unit for mass is Kg
- #8
brum
- 81
- 0
The SI unit for weight may be the Newton, but it's perfectly legit to use the pound (lb) for weight. If someone uses the pound to describe an object's weight and not the Newton, so be it, there's nothing objectable to that. You can very easily switch between pounds and Newtons with a simple conversion, anyways.
- #9
Adrian Baker
- 378
- 2
You can't use the pound for both mass and weight - they are completely different quantities!
The SI unit for Mass is Kg, the Imperial unit is the pound.
The SI unit for weight is the Newton, the Imperial unit is the pound-force, not the pound.
- #10
- 3,768
- 1,982
It entirely depends on what Unit system you are using.
In the absolute FPS system, the unit of force is the poundal and the unit of mass is the pound.
In the gravitational FPS system, the unit of force is the pound and the unit of mass is the slug.
In the American Engineering Standard, the pound is used for both mass and force. (sometimes designated as lbm and lbf , but many times you are just supposed to know what it is being used for by context.)
- #11
russ_watters
Mentor
- 23,876
- 11,345
Exactly...
That's if he weighed 150lb on earth...who said anything about what he weighs on earth?
In the US we do - layman and engineers alike. Heck, if you make your bathroom scale read in kg, its using kg as weight!
For more on lb vs kg, etc, see THIS thread in the General Engineering forum.
[/shameless plug]
- #12
Adrian Baker
- 378
- 2
No wonder NASA sent a probe to Mars that missed completely as someone had used the wrong units for thrust calculations!
- #13
NateTG
Science Advisor
Homework Helper
- 2,449
- 7
Actually, there are situations where pounds (force) and pounds (mass) are both used. For example, calculating specific impulse.
Specific impulse is a unit that describes the amount of thrust that is achieved per mass of fuel consumed per second.
In SI the units of specific thrus are:
Newtons / (Killograms/Second) = Meters Per Second.
(This is accurate since specific impulse is essentially determined by the relative velocity of the rocket exhaust.)
In standard the units of specific thrust are:
(Pounds (force))/(Pounds (mass)/Second)= seconds