Magnetism in Metals: Permanent vs. Temporary Magnets

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the differences between permanent and temporary magnets, specifically exploring why certain metals can be magnetized while others, like copper, cannot. Participants delve into concepts such as ferromagnetism, paramagnetism, and diamagnetism, discussing their characteristics and underlying mechanisms.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that interatomic coupling is key to understanding why certain metals can be magnetized, with references to Curie Temperature affecting ferromagnetism and paramagnetism.
  • One participant notes that ferromagnetism involves the alignment of interatomic domains that can remain aligned after the removal of an applied magnetic field, while acknowledging uncertainty about the coupling mechanism of these domains.
  • Another participant describes paramagnetism as the alignment of magnetic moments of electrons and protons in response to a magnetic field, but emphasizes that this effect is weaker than ferromagnetism.
  • There is a mention of diamagnetism, characterized by the induced precession of electron orbitals in response to a magnetic field, which may cause repulsion from the field.
  • Participants express uncertainty about the completeness of their explanations and the definitions of terms like "bimagnetism," with one suggesting it may refer to "diamagnetism."

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the mechanisms behind magnetism in different materials, and multiple competing views remain regarding the definitions and characteristics of ferromagnetism, paramagnetism, and diamagnetism.

Contextual Notes

Some participants acknowledge gaps in their understanding of the coupling of domains in ferromagnetism and the conditions under which different magnetic properties manifest, indicating a need for further exploration of these concepts.

alchemist
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why can certain metals be magnetised but others like copper cannot?
what what is the difference between permanent magnet and temporary magnets?
 
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It has to do with interatomic coupling. I think (not absolutely positive) that all materials have what is called a Curie Temperature. Above this temperature, the ferromagnetism changes to paramagnetism, and the material cannot hold the magnetism without the applied field. Fe, Co, and Ni all have Curie temperatures much higher than room temperature. The higher the temperature, the more thermal vibrations break the interatomic coupling, and destroy the domains in the material.

I was once told that it has something to do with the d-orbitals, but that never made very much sense to me.
 
wads ferromagnetism and paramgnetism and as well as bimagnetism?
 
alchemist said:
wads ferromagnetism ...?
Ferromagnetism is the characteristic of responding to an applied magnetic field by the allignment of interatomic domains that remain alligned after the applied field is removed.

The coupling of the domains (this is the part that I don't quite understand: how/why they are coupled) is stronger than the intermitant jolts that the atoms receive from thermal vibration. The higher the temperature, the stronger the thermal vibrations, so the ferromagnetism of a material is temperature dependent. Also note that, since thermal vibrations are statistical, there are always a few here and there that are strong enough to jolt the domains apart. The domains quite often recombine and reallign due to the presence of the field from the other domains. However, after a sufficiently long time, the magnetism eventually decays.




alchemist said:
wads ... paramgnetism ...?
Paramagnetism is the characteristic of responding to an applied magnetic field by the allignment of the magnetic moments of the electrons themselves (not orbital, but spin) and the allignment of the magnetic moments of the protons (maybe quarks, not sure).

All materials exhibit paramagnetism. This causes a slight attraction by virtue of the minimization of the configuration energy due to the allignment. The attraction is nowhere near as pronounced as in the case of ferromagnetism.




alchemist said:
wads ... bimagnetism?
I'll assume that you mean "diamagnetism," because I've never heard of bimagnetism.

Diamagnetism is the characteristic of responding to an applied magnetic field by the induced precession of the electron orbitals.

I'm not sure if all materials exhibit this property. This actually cases materials to be repelled by a magnetic field (to be more precise, paramagnetism and ferromagnetism motivate materials in the direction of the gradient of the magnetic field whereas diamagnetism motivates materials in the opposite direction as the gradient. Strictly speaking, a magnetic field does not cause the influence on a material, the gradient does.) This property can cause (has been shown to accurately predict) levitation.
 
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