Integrating Trigonometric Functions: Need Help!

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around integrating the inverse trigonometric functions arctan(y) and arcsin(x). Participants explore various methods for solving these integrals, primarily focusing on integration by parts.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant requests help with integrating arctan(y) and arcsin(x), expressing uncertainty about the trigonometric formula for integration.
  • Another participant suggests using integration by parts for both integrals, indicating that it is a suitable method.
  • A different participant questions whether a trigonometric method is necessary, proposing that integration by parts could suffice.
  • A participant requests a demonstration of integration by parts, indicating a lack of familiarity with the concept.
  • One participant provides a detailed substitution method for integrating arctan(y), including steps for using integration by parts.
  • Another participant presents an alternative approach to the same integral, using integration by parts without the substitution, leading to a different expression for the integral.
  • Some participants express curiosity about the choice of substitution and the reasoning behind different approaches to the problem.
  • There is a mention of the need to look up the derivative of arctan if not memorized, suggesting reliance on integral tables as a possible solution.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a range of approaches to the integration problems, with no consensus on a single method. Different viewpoints on the necessity of substitution and the use of integration by parts are present, indicating ongoing debate.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty regarding the core concepts of integration by parts and the derivatives of inverse trigonometric functions, which may affect their understanding of the solutions presented.

Jeebus
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I need help with these problems:

(1) STan^-1(y)dy

and

(2) Ssin^-1(x)dx

(S=integral)

I can't seem to figure out the trigonometric formula for integration. A little help or hint would be nice. Thanks!
 
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Are you talking about arctan and arcsine (the inverse functions)?
If so, use integration by parts in both cases, with 1 as the function you integrate.
 
Do you have to use a trigonometric method to integrate those? I think they could both be readily solved with integration by parts.

Edit: arildno beat me to it :)

If you need help with integration by parts, let us know. It works really well in this case.
 
Um, arildno or TALewis can you show me how to do it using integration by parts. I just learned this relatively recently and haven't got the core concepts down. If you could show me, it would be much appreciated.

Thanks! :approve:
 
Thread Title said:
Aarr, help

Aasrr, i was born on a pirate ship! ok now that i got that out of my system...

i'm assuming for the problem you mean:

1 )[tex]\int arctan(y)[/tex] [tex]dy[/tex]

and

2)[tex]\int arcsin(x)[/tex] [tex]dx[/tex]

(thats the inverse tangent and inverse sine functions respectively). In that case you must perfomr a substitution before using integration by parts:

1)

[tex]\theta = arctan(y)[/tex]

[tex]tan(\theta) = y[/tex]

[tex]dy = sec^2(\theta)[/tex] [tex]d\theta[/tex]

So the integral becomes:

[tex]\int \theta*sec^(\theta)[/tex] [tex]d\theta[/tex]

which using integration by parts gives:

[tex]\int u[/tex] [tex]dv = u*v-\int v[/tex] [tex]du[/tex]

with

[tex]u = \theta[/tex]
[tex]dv = sec^2(\theta)[/tex]

so

[tex]\int \theta*sec^2(\theta)[/tex] [tex]d\theta = \theta*tan(\theta)-\int tan(\theta)[/tex] [tex]d\theta[/tex]

[tex]= \theta*tan(\theta) + ln|cos \theta|[/tex]

So substituting for theta we get

[tex]\int arctan (y)[/tex] [tex]dy = yarctan(y) + ln|cos(arctan y)|[/tex]
[tex]=y*arctan(y) + ln|\frac{1}{\sqrt{1+y^2}}|[/tex]
[tex]=y*arctan(y) - \frac{1}{2}ln|y^2+1|[/tex]
[tex]=y*arctan(y) - \frac{1}{2}ln(y^2 + 1)[/tex]

U can use a similar substitution in the second problem (simply construct a right triangle, substitute theta in, integrate, and the substitute x back in.

Note: LaTeX still hates me...eventually i'll get it to look right...
 
Last edited:
franznietzsche, I am curious why you made that substitution. I approach the problem this way. We want to evaluate:

[tex]\int \tan^{-1}y\,dy = I[/tex]

I use capital I to denote the integral to be evaluated.

I choose the following directly from the integral:

[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> u &= \tan^{-1}y & du &= \frac{dy}{1+y^2}\\<br /> dv &= dy & v &= y<br /> \end{align}[/tex]

Integration by parts is given by:

[tex]\int u\,dv = uv-\int v\,du[/tex]

So I have:

[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> I&=y\tan^{-1}y - \int \frac{y\,dy}{1+y^2}\\<br /> \therefore \int \tan^{-1}y\,dy&=y\tan^{-1}y - \frac{1}{2}\ln(1+y^2)<br /> \end{align}[/tex]
 
Last edited:
TALewis said:
franznietzsche, I am curious why you made that substitution. I approach the problem this way. We want to evaluate:

[tex]\int \tan^{-1}y\,dy = I[/tex]

I use capital I to denote the integral to be evaluated.

I choose the following directly from the integral:

[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> u &= \tan^{-1}y & du &= \frac{dy}{1+y^2}\\<br /> dv &= dy & v &= y<br /> \end{align}[/tex]

Integration by parts is given by:

[tex]\int u\,dv = uv-\int v\,du[/tex]

So I have:

[tex] \begin{align*}<br /> I&=y\tan^{-1}y - \int \frac{y\,dy}{1+y^2}\\<br /> \therefore \int \tan^{-1}y\,dy&=y\tan^{-1}y - \frac{1}{2}\ln(1+y^2)<br /> \end{align}[/tex]


I suppose some combination of liking trig substitutions inherently and not wanting to differetiate [tex]arctan y[/tex] simply because i didn't know it offhand and didn't want to look it up.
 
Hm, I agree. If you don't have the derivative of arctan memorized, you have to look it up. And while you're looking things up, you might as well just use an integral table anyway.
 
  • #10
TALewis said:
Hm, I agree. If you don't have the derivative of arctan memorized, you have to look it up. And while you're looking things up, you might as well just use an integral table anyway.

yup, exactly.
 

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