Capaticance of thin spherical ball

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of capacitance in relation to a thin spherical ball that is uncharged and has a charge placed near it. Participants explore the implications of induced charges and the necessity of a reference point for defining capacitance, particularly in the context of spherical geometries.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that an uncharged thin spherical ball will have capacitance due to the induced charge when a positive charge is placed nearby.
  • Others argue that capacitance requires a reference point to be defined, specifically mentioning the formula C = Q / (φ(A) - φ(B)), where φ(A) is the potential on the surface of the ball and φ(B) is the potential at the reference point.
  • A participant clarifies that if the reference point is taken to be at infinity, the potential there must vanish, allowing for the derivation of the capacitance of the spherical ball.
  • There is a request for clarification regarding φ(B) and which surface it refers to, indicating some confusion about the reference point in the context of capacitance.
  • Another participant responds by explaining that the reference surface is at infinity, likening it to a giant spherical capacitor with the outer shell at infinity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that capacitance can be defined in this context, but there is some disagreement regarding the specifics of the reference point and the implications of potential at infinity. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the clarity of φ(B).

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the reference point and the potential at infinity, which may affect the understanding of capacitance in this scenario. The discussion does not resolve the mathematical steps involved in deriving capacitance.

astro2cosmos
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suppose there is a uncharged thin spherical ball (thickness tends to 0) then Does if have any capacitance if a +q charge is placed near it?
 
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yes there will be an induced charge on the shell due to which there will be some capacitance
 
iitjee10 said:
yes there will be an induced charge on the shell due to which there will be some capacitance

ok! but capacitance is always b/w two quantities having a distance d.then for a sphere?
 
Yes, you need a reference point to specify the capacitance of the spherical ball, due to

[tex]C = \frac{Q}{\phi(A) - \phi(B)}[/tex]

with [tex]\phi(A)[/tex]: potential on the surface of the ball; [tex]\phi(B)[/tex]: potential on the surface, the reference point is on

If the reference point is in infinity, we know that the potential in infinity must vanish, cause only in this case the energy is finite. So we can take [tex]B=\infty[/tex] (imagine a giant spherical capacitor which outer shell is in infinity with the potential [tex]\phi(\infty)=0[/tex]). In this term we can derive the capacitance of the spherical ball!
 
saunderson said:
Yes, you need a reference point to specify the capacitance of the spherical ball, due to

[tex]C = \frac{Q}{\phi(A) - \phi(B)}[/tex]

with [tex]\phi(A)[/tex]: potential on the surface of the ball; [tex]\phi(B)[/tex]: potential on the surface, the reference point is on

If the reference point is in infinity, we know that the potential in infinity must vanish, cause only in this case the energy is finite. So we can take [tex]B=\infty[/tex] (imagine a giant spherical capacitor which outer shell is in infinity with the potential [tex]\phi(\infty)=0[/tex]). In this term we can derive the capacitance of the spherical ball!

i didn't get the phi(B)}[/tex]. which surface do you mention here??
 
astro2cosmos said:
i didn't get the phi(B)}[/tex]. which surface do you mention here??

This surface is in infinity ! Like I've said, imagine a giant spherical capacitor, with the inner shell of radius R1="radius of your spherical ball" and the the outer shell [tex]R_2 \rightarrow \infty[/tex]... kind of hard to imagine, but if you don't have a reference point take it in infinity, cause there is always zero potential.
 

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