Observational Difference Between Neutron Star & Black Hole

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the observational differences between neutron stars and black holes, exploring the evidence for their existence and the challenges in distinguishing between the two types of astronomical objects. Participants consider both theoretical and observational aspects, including specific cases and conditions under which these distinctions may be made.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that certain black holes are too massive to be neutron stars, suggesting a clear distinction based on mass.
  • Observations of stars orbiting a massive object, such as the black hole at the center of the galaxy, provide indirect evidence of black holes, but the nature of black holes makes direct observation impossible.
  • One participant speculates that distinguishing between neutron stars and black holes may depend on the presence of an accretion disk, which would emit X-rays that could indicate a black hole's presence.
  • Another participant highlights that pulsars serve as strong evidence for neutron stars, although not all neutron stars are detectable as pulsars due to alignment issues.
  • Mass measurements of stars in binary systems can indicate whether the companion is a neutron star or a black hole based on specific mass thresholds.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conclusiveness of evidence for black holes and neutron stars. While some argue that black holes cannot be directly observed and their existence is inferred, others point to specific observational evidence that suggests the presence of neutron stars and black holes under certain conditions. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the definitive methods for distinguishing between the two.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in the current understanding, including the dependence on indirect observations and the challenges posed by the nature of black holes. There is also recognition of the need for precise conditions to differentiate between neutron stars and black holes.

turin
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What is the observational difference between a neutron star and a black hole? Is the evidence conclusive, or is it based on a strong reasonability argument?
 
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turin said:
What is the observational difference between a neutron star and a black hole? Is the evidence conclusive, or is it based on a strong reasonability argument?

part of the answer is obvious and you know already---hope you will be patient if I mention it, just to narrow down the question

some of the BH astronomers observe are too massive to be neutron stars

the black hole at center of our galaxy has mass of several million solar
as measured by watching a star whip around it----results and analysis are online, it was ESO that observed it, but I don't have the links handy

the narrowed-down question is then
what are the observational difference between a n-star and a stellar mass BH?

Basically I'm going to wait and hear what the more knowledgeable people say---but I will speculate that you can't always tell the difference or be sure which you are looking at. What would let you tell the difference is if there was a lot of stuff falling into the hole----so the accretion disk is very hot and bright in X-ray... there would be an X-ray temperature and brightness too great for a neutron start to produce.

Another case would be of a pulsar, from the magnetic field frozen in the n-star, and the poles of the magnetic field not aligned with the axis of rotation. I can't imagine how a BH could imitate a pulsar signal.

what i think it may come down to is that you can distinguish between n-star and BH in certain cases but not always

apologies for rushing ahead with speculation---very curious to hear what
the authoritative word on this is
 
Conclusive evidence of almost anything regarding a black hole is a near impossibility. Black holes cannot be observed by their very nature. If we find an object we are able to observe, it is not black hole. Therefore, since no black hole has ever been directly "observed", they're very existence is (and ever shall be) inferred by reason. That being said, some observations lead to no other "reasonable" conclusion than the existence of a black hole. At least, none that we know of.
 
Pulsars are the smoking gun evidence of neutron stars. However, not all neutron stars are pulsars. Only those whose rotational axis is properly aligned with our line of sight give detectable pulses. Neutron stars in binary systems are detectable by their mass. The mass will be above the electron degeneracy [Chandrasekhar] limit [about 1.44 solar masses] but less than the neutron degeneracy limit [about 3 solar masses]. So if you find a star orbiting an invisible companion, the companion is probably a neutron star if it has a mass between 1.44 and 3 solar masses. If it is over 3 solar masses, like Cygnus X-1 [which is about 10 solar masses], it most likely is a black hole.
 

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