How Are Position and Momentum Connected by the Uncertainty Principle?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between position and momentum, particularly in the context of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle. Participants explore how these concepts are defined and their interdependence within a frame of reference.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the definitions of position and momentum, emphasizing their dependence on initial conditions and reference frames. Questions arise regarding the relationship between uncertainties in position and momentum, with some seeking clarification on the mathematical formulation of the uncertainty principle.

Discussion Status

The conversation is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the definitions and relationships of the concepts involved. There is a mix of attempts to clarify the uncertainty principle and questions about the correctness of presented equations. Some guidance has been offered regarding the mathematical relationship, but no consensus has been reached.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of the uncertainty principle and its implications for their specific problem, noting the need for clarity on how uncertainties in position and momentum are related. There is an acknowledgment of the arbitrary nature of initial conditions in motion equations.

CollectiveRocker
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How are position and momentum related?
 
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The momentum of an object depends on its velocity, which is the time derivative of its position. So if you have the position as a function of time, you know the velocity, and therefore the momentum of a particle:

However: as I've just learned elsewhere on the forum, a particle can begin its motion at a specific location with a specific velocity...these initial conditions are completely arbitrary (and independent of each other...at whatever time we are considering to be the initial time, the particle could start off anywhere with any velocity. ). Yet these initial conditions, or some boundary conditions, must be known in order to 'fix' a solution to the equations of motion. Only then is the relationship between position and velocity (and therefore momentum) is known. It is not known beforehand. I hope this helps.
 
CollectiveRocker said:
How are position and momentum related?
First of all, position and momentum must be defined with respect to a frame of reference. You can only talk about an object's velocity, momentum and position relative to something else.

Velocity is the rate of change of position with respect to time. Momentum is defined as mass multiplied by its velocity. So position and momentum are related by mass and time.

AM
 
The reason why I ask is that I'm working on a problem where the position and momentum are simultaneously discovered. I know the uncertainty in the position, yet was wondering how to find the uncertainty in the momentum. I'm not asking for you to do the problem for me; just to give me a smalll push in the right direction. Thanks.
 
CollectiveRocker said:
The reason why I ask is that I'm working on a problem where the position and momentum are simultaneously discovered. I know the uncertainty in the position, yet was wondering how to find the uncertainty in the momentum. I'm not asking for you to do the problem for me; just to give me a smalll push in the right direction. Thanks.
Ok. Your question is not how position and momentum are related but how uncertainty of position is related to the uncertainty of momentum. That is the Heisenberg uncertainty principle:
[tex]\Delta p \Delta x = h[/tex] where h = Planck's constant and p refers to momentum and x to position

AM
 
Are you positive that your equation is correct?
 
How do I find the percentage of uncertainty in the particle's momentum?
 
CollectiveRocker said:
Are you positive that your equation is correct?


Not really correct.Now I'm sure that Andrew knows the correct mathematical formulation of Heisenberg's principle,but he presented u with a form that could be easier to use in calculus,since it's an equality,while the real form in not.

I guess the push in the right direction has been given,since u have one equation with one unknown very simple to find.
 
CollectiveRocker said:
Are you positive that your equation is correct?
I should have used [itex]\Delta x \Delta p \approx h[/itex]. It is an uncertainty principle after all. It is really just an order of magnitude relationship which states that the uncertainty of position multiplied by the uncertainty of momentum is on the order of Planck's constant.

AM
 

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