Infinite and improper integral help.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the evaluation of integrals with infinite limits and improper integrals, exploring definitions, examples, and conditions under which these integrals exist or diverge. Participants share their understanding and seek clarification on various aspects of the topic.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants discuss the definition of improper integrals, noting that \(\int_a^{\infty}f(x)dx\) is defined as the limit of \(\int^L_af(x) dx\) as \(L\) approaches infinity, though this limit may not always exist.
  • One participant mentions that there is no difference between Riemann improper integrals and those with infinite limits, suggesting a general form for such integrals.
  • Another participant challenges this view, stating that the lower and upper limits of every integral must tend to infinity independently.
  • Questions are raised about how to determine whether an integral exists, with examples provided to illustrate the inquiry.
  • Participants discuss the conditions under which an integral is considered improper, such as being unbounded at certain points or having infinite limits.
  • There is a mention of specific functions that are often unbounded, such as \(1/x\) and logarithmic functions, which may contribute to the classification of an integral as improper.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the treatment of improper integrals and the conditions for their existence. There is no consensus on the definitions and approaches discussed, indicating ongoing debate and exploration of the topic.

Contextual Notes

Some participants' claims depend on specific definitions and assumptions about integrals, which may not be universally accepted. The discussion includes unresolved mathematical steps and varying interpretations of what constitutes an improper integral.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and practitioners in mathematics and physics who are grappling with the concepts of improper integrals and their evaluation.

misogynisticfeminist
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I can't seem to evaluate integrals with infinite limits as well as improper integrals. Can anyone help in that? Sorry if this is a little vague but I'm stumped by the whole topic !
 
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[tex]\int_a^{\infty}f(x)dx[/tex]

is defined to be the limit as L tends to infinity of

[tex]\int^L_af(x) dx[/tex]

when it exists (it may not do).

[tex]\int_1^{\infty}\frac{1}{x^2}dx = \text{lim}_{L\to \infty}(\frac{-1}{L}+1) = 1[/tex]
 
misogynisticfeminist said:
I can't seem to evaluate integrals with infinite limits as well as improper integrals. Can anyone help in that? Sorry if this is a little vague but I'm stumped by the whole topic !

To add ot Matt's post,there is no difference between Riemann improper integrals and the ones with infinit limits.The most general form of such an integral is
[tex]I=\int\int...\int_{R^{n}} f(x_{1},x_{2},...,x_{n}) dx_{1}dx_{2}...dx_{n}=:\lim_{L\rightarrow \infty} \int_{-L}^{+L}\int_{-L}^{+L}...\int_{-L}^{+L} f(x_{1},x_{2},...,x_{n}) dx_{1}dx_{2}...dx_{n}[/tex]

Sometimes,such integrals diverge.Physics often deals with such integrals and it asks for finite results.
Many,very many improper integrals are tabulated in the book by the 2 Russian Jews:Gradsteyn & Rytzhik.

Daniel.
 
That's not correct, must let the lower and upper limits of every integral tend to infinity independently.
 
It looks like dex is talking about a generalization of the Cauchy principal value of an integral.
 
hmmmm i get the infinite integrals part already. But there are still a few more questions.

1. How do I find out whether an integral exists or not?

in perhaps the example,

[tex]\int_{1}^{\infty} \frac {1}{x+1} dx[/tex],

why doesn't it exist?

2. In an improper integral, how do I find the range in which the integral is infinite? Or is it already stated?

In the example,

[tex]\int_{0}^{2} (2-x) ^{-1/4} dx[/tex]

If the substituition of [tex]2- \delta[/tex] where delta tends towards zero and 0 into the integral, I would get,

[tex]-\frac {4}{3} \delta ^{3/4} + \frac {4}{3} 2^{3/4}[/tex]

the final answer would be without the term delta, how do I get rid of it?

3. Also, when given an integral just like that, how would I be able to tell it apart from an improper integral and just any plain old one?
 
In you first example, after integrating, we are left with [tex](ln|x+1||_1^L[/tex]. Taking the limit, as L tends to infinity yields infinity, and thus we say that the integral diverges, or does not exist.

In the second one, the integral is unbounded at x=2, and is thus improper. So [tex]\int_0^2 (2-x) ^{-1/4} dx = \text{lim}_{L\to 2-} \int_0^L (2-x) ^{-1/4} dx[/tex]
From there, just integrate and take the limit.

Regarding the third, for an integral to be improper, one of its limits must be infinite, or it must be unbounded at some point over the interval.

Then again, I may have completely misunderstood your questions.
 
Hey I've finally understood it, thanks. But there is still the part where,...

How do I know whether an integral is unbounded at a certain interval? Is it usually because of fractions where there is 1/0 and this yields infinity? Is there any other cases?
 
Yes, it is probably most often when you have a function of the form 1/x but in general, the function is unbounded at x=n when [tex]\text{lim}_{x\to n} f(x) =\infty[/tex]

Thats just a rule off the top of my head so that may be wrong. Notable cases that come to mind other than 1/x are both log and ln, which are unbounded for x=0. Hope that helps.
 
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