Do Photons Follow the Rules of Mechanics for Collisions?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the behavior of photons in collisions and whether they adhere to classical mechanics principles. Participants explore the implications of photon momentum transfer, energy conservation, and the mechanisms involved in photon interactions with other particles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant manipulates equations related to energy and momentum to question whether photons follow the usual rules of mechanics during collisions.
  • Another participant confirms that the momentum of a photon is h/λ and mentions its involvement in Compton scattering and absorption by electrons.
  • A participant references the energy-momentum relation for particles and notes that photons can transfer substantial energy to massive particles.
  • There is a query regarding the mechanisms of momentum transfer and whether it leads to increased orbital energy or other effects.
  • Discussion includes the effects of lower energy photons resulting in heat and higher energy photons causing ionization or pair production.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the mechanics of photon interactions and energy transfer, indicating that multiple competing views remain without a clear consensus on the implications for energy conservation or the nature of collisions.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the definitions of energy transfer mechanisms and the conditions under which photons interact with matter are not fully explored, leaving certain aspects unresolved.

Jeebus
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If you do some simple manipulations of the equations E=hf, E=1/2mv^2, P=mv, and p=h/<lambda>, one can derive that the momentum is h/<lambda> or that it is h/(2<lambda>). I know that photons do not always follow normal mechanics, but do they follow the usual rules for mechanics for collisions?

I have heard of numerous situations in which photons have transferred their momentum to other particles or even larger masses, but it is unclear to me how exactly this works. It seems that one could build a device which would have an efficiency greater than 100 percent. In other words, it would not follow the law of conservation of energy.

Why can this not be done?

Is it because the photons transfer energy through various mechanisms, depending on energy?
 
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The momentum of a photon is h/&lambda; and yes they can be involved in collisions with free electrons (compton scattering), where their wavelength is depednet on their angle of scattering. Photons can be absorbed by electrons in bound states too.
 
Originally posted by Jeebus
I have heard of numerous situations in which photons have transferred their momentum to other particles or even larger masses

Is this why you say that...

...It seems that one could build a device which would have an efficiency greater than 100 percent.

??

The energy of a particle is given by

E2 = m2c4 + p2c2

A photon, being massless, has an energy E = pc, which can be quite substantial, and it definitely can be transferred to massive particles.
 
a photon transfers its momentum or used to increase orbit enegy? 2 different cases or what? Exactly how does it transfer momemtum
 
In lower energy photons it usually results in heat. Higher energy photons, in about the UV range or greater, can ionize atoms by ejecting electrons. On the extreme end the photons can undergo Pair Production, where a photon interacts with a nucleus and its energy is used to create pairs of particles such as an electron and positron.
 

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