Relativity and the Laser Beam: Is Faster-Than-Light Travel Possible?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the possibility of faster-than-light travel, specifically in relation to a laser beam and its behavior when passing through a high-density gas. Participants explore concepts from relativity, group velocity, and wave behavior in different media.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a laser beam can be accelerated faster than the speed of light by passing through a high-density gas, suggesting that relativity only prohibits faster-than-light travel in a vacuum.
  • Others argue that while particles can exceed the speed of light in a medium (as in the case of Cherenkov radiation), the interpretation of light itself traveling faster than light remains unclear.
  • A participant mentions that a superposition of waves can result in a group velocity that exceeds the speed of light in a vacuum, but clarifies that this does not imply actual information or matter is traveling faster than light.
  • There is a technical explanation regarding the phase relationship of different frequencies in wave packets, which contributes to the observed group velocity exceeding the speed of light.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of light traveling faster than light in a medium, with no consensus reached on the validity of the initial claim regarding laser beams and relativity.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the importance of distinguishing between group velocity and phase velocity, as well as the effects of dispersion in different media, which complicate the discussion of light speed in various contexts.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying relativity, wave mechanics, and the behavior of light in different media, as well as individuals curious about the implications of faster-than-light phenomena.

Cosmo16
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I saw this awhile ago, I don't remember where though.

Supposdly some scientists accelereted the beam of a laser faster then the speed of light, by shooting it through a high density gas. The opinion being that Relativity only states that nothing can go faster then the speed of light in a vaccum. is this a vaild conclusion? I don't know enough about relativity to know for myself, but it seems like a valid conclusion to me.
 
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Cosmo16 said:
I saw this awhile ago, I don't remember where though.
Supposdly some scientists accelereted the beam of a laser faster then the speed of light, by shooting it through a high density gas. The opinion being that Relativity only states that nothing can go faster then the speed of light in a vaccum. is this a vaild conclusion? I don't know enough about relativity to know for myself, but it seems like a valid conclusion to me.
I'm just guessing, but I think what happened was that a particle, perhaps an electron, was accelerated in a gas to a velocity that was less than the speed of light in vacuum, but greater than the speed of light in that gas. Such speeds are achieved routinely and are the source of a phenomenon known as Chernenkov radiation.

However as you have worded it, it sounds like it was a laser beam and not a particle that was shot. I can't guess what is meant by light traveling faster than light.
 
A superposition (sum) of waves was sent through a medium such that the group velocity (Yes, group velocity!) of the resulting wave packet moved faster than the speed of light in a vacuum. Greg Egan has a nice animation of this http://gregegan.customer.netspace.net.au/APPLETS/20/20.html" .

From Egan's webpage: "Nothing is actually traveling with these peaks, though; they're just an artifact of the way the different frequencies are slipping in and out of phase."

Don't hesitate to come back if you have questions.

Regards,
George
 
Last edited by a moderator:
What does he mean by "the way the different frequencies are slipping in and out of phase"

P.S. Thanks for the link, the animation helped.
 
Two waves are completely in phase if their crests line up or if their troughs line up, and completely out of phase if the crests in one wave line up with the troughs in the other. When waves are in phase, they tend to reinforce each other; when waves are out of phase, they tend to cancel each other.

In the animation, two effects have to be taken into account: 1) different colours have different wavelengths; 2) different colours move at different speeds.

The reason for 2) is as follows. The index of refraction of a medium is defined as the ratio of the speed of light in a vacuum to the (effective) speed of light in the medium, i.e., n = c/v. Thus, v = c/n. In what is called a dispersive medium, the index of refraction is slightly different for different colours of light. Since n depends on colour and c is constant, v depends on colour.

The combination of 1) and 2) above cause the different colours to slip in and out of phase.

Regards,
George
 

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