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Earth's Gravity (Fundamental Forces)

by Intuitive
Tags: earth, forces, fundamental, gravity
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Intuitive
#1
Oct27-05, 01:20 PM
P: 271
If we listed all Fundamental Forces that make up Earth's Gravity, What percentage would Electro/Magnetism fall under for its influence within Gravity, I assume it would be a (minimal) of around 75% percent of the Gravity we experience, If we have all the other percentages for the other remaining Fundamental Forces involved with the Gravity force mix, What would their percentages be too?
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Andre
#2
Oct27-05, 02:30 PM
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Dunno.

Why would electromagnetism have impact on the gravity of Earth. If you're thinking of pure physical tying of electromagnetism with gravity in general, this may not be the best place.

As I observe for instance that Venus, unlike Earth, has no observable magnetic field but has a gravity that nicely fits with the good ol Newtonian physics, I could not think of a logical relationship between gravity and EM.
Intuitive
#3
Oct27-05, 04:57 PM
P: 271
Quote Quote by Andre
Dunno.
Why would electromagnetism have impact on the gravity of Earth. If you're thinking of pure physical tying of electromagnetism with gravity in general, this may not be the best place.
As I observe for instance that Venus, unlike Earth, has no observable magnetic field but has a gravity that nicely fits with the good ol Newtonian physics, I could not think of a logical relationship between gravity and EM.
pseudo example:

the materials your body contains is Magnetic, Ferromagnetic, Diamagnetic and may contain Anti-ferromagnetism, ferrimagnetism, and Paramagnetic materials.

If a person stands on a pseudo platform and this platform is increasing in Magnetic strength per second into infinity, How strong would the Magnetic strength have to be before the magnetic platform is strong in field strength to bind you to its surface like a gravitational field equivalent to Earths gravity per square inch?

At one point the Magnetic pull would be so great that it would weld you to its surface if it becomes mega-magnetic in field strength.

A type of pseudo gravity.

Intuitive
#4
Oct28-05, 02:10 AM
P: 271
Earth's Gravity (Fundamental Forces)

I know falling from 1 foot in height to the ground doesn't seem dangerous, but, if the ground below you is in or around or above 100+ Telsa in Magnetic field strength then I would suggest purchasing some good crutches before attempting the one foot drop as the Tesla strength increases.

Also, Magnetism has (infinite) force influence, shielding and propagation only decreases its influence but does not cancel it.
Mk
#5
Oct28-05, 02:38 AM
P: 2,056
Water is the only substance that of which a high strength magnetic field would have much of an effect on. Water is diamagnetic, meaning very weak repelling forces. Reminds me of the great floating frog: http://www.hfml.science.ru.nl/froglev.html

This illustration shows how difficult it is to make something float using diamagnetic phenomena. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:D...on_diagram.gif

And look at the results: http://wondermagnet.com/diacglev.html Ooooh pretty! ehh?

Also, the limit to an electromagnetic field strength is about 1013 T. Why is there a maximum you ask? I'll quote Tide on this:
Quote Quote by Tide
Magnetic fields arise from the flow of current or the intrinsic magnetic moment of a spinning particle (which is essentially a current). The speed of light limits the flow of current and charge is invariant under Einstein-Lorentz transformation. Assuming finite charge density, magnetic fields due to electrical current are therefore bounded by the speed of light.
Also, and interesting related phenomenon, called phosphenes would show their presence in your experiment. A phosphene is characterized by the experience of light without light coming into the eye. Phosphenes have been created by intense, changing magnetic fields, such as with transcranial magnetic stimulation. These fields can be positioned on different parts of the head to stimulate cells in different parts of the visual system.
Intuitive
#6
Oct28-05, 03:17 AM
P: 271
From what I have heard, After a certain Magnetic Saturation point, even Diamagnetic Materials become Magnetic in Nature. This varies with different materials and many other factors are involved like Temperature dependency.

Even Water under a certain Magnetic saturation point will become Magnetic Given the field strength is strong enough.

I do not know if Diamagnetism can exist in a direct 100+ Telsa Magnetic field, the probabilty is that it will become Magnetic due to the field saturation.

I remember seeing and reading about the floating frog years ago, very cool.
Jimmy Snyder
#7
Oct28-05, 01:58 PM
P: 2,179
I assume that the motivation for your question comes from the knowledge that at the atomic level, electrical, strong and weak forces are so much stronger than gravitational forces. However, strong and weak forces are so short ranged that they have no influence outside of the nucleus of the atom. Also only the net charge counts for electrical force, and the earth has a net charge near zero. But all of the mass counts for gravitational force, and the earth has a lot of mass. Having said that, I give two answers to your question.

If you mean that we are electrically charged and the earth is electrically charged and the force of attraction of these charged bodies is in the same direction as the gravitational force, then there isn't enough charge to make a difference. So the answer to your question is it's all gravity and practically no electricity.

However, if the only force on us was gravitational, then we would fall to the center of the earth. There must be some other force that balances it out and leaves us with zero acceleration (relative to the center of the earth). There are electrical forces holding the individual atoms of our bodies together and holding the atoms of the earth together. These electrical forces exert an upward force on us just equal to the gravitational force drawing us downward. The net force is zero and we neither fall nor float. So the answer to your question is gravitational and electrical forces are equal and in opposite directions.
Mk
#8
Oct30-05, 11:07 PM
P: 2,056
Quote Quote by Intuitive
Even Water under a certain Magnetic saturation point will become Magnetic Given the field strength is strong enough.
Diamagnetic is a form of magnetism in which an external magnetic field is needed for it to initialize.
I do not know if Diamagnetism can exist in a direct 100+ Telsa Magnetic field
There is no external field strength too high for a diamagnetic material to retain its field.
I remember seeing and reading about the floating frog years ago, very cool.
Yes it is.


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