News Michael Moore's Sicko Banned in Cuba, Too Rosy

  • Thread starter Thread starter talk2glenn
  • Start date Start date
AI Thread Summary
Cuba banned Michael Moore's documentary "Sicko" because it presented an overly favorable view of the country's healthcare system, which officials feared could incite public backlash. Cuban doctors reportedly walked out during a screening due to the film's perceived distortions. The U.S. State Department noted that the film's portrayal was not credible to Cubans, highlighting the government's concern over its potential impact. Despite claims from Moore that the ban was propaganda, the film was shown on Cuban national TV in 2008, suggesting a complex narrative surrounding its reception. The discussion underscores skepticism about Moore's objectivity and the broader implications of healthcare portrayals in media.
talk2glenn
Michael Moore's "Sicko" Banned in Cuba, Too "Rosy"

Has Assange proven himself useful, after all?

The Cubans banned the Michael Moore propaganda piece because it painted too rosy a picture of the local healthcare system, which no Cuban would have believed, according to the State Department. Apparently a group of Cuban doctors who were allowed by Dear Fidel to watch the "documentary" were so upset by the distortions that they walked out! This sounds like satire, I know, but apparently its true. Too rich.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/17/wikileaks-cuba-banned-sicko

Cuba banned Michael Moore's 2007 documentary, Sicko, because it painted such a "mythically" favourable picture of Cuba's healthcare system that the authorities feared it could lead to a "popular backlash", according to US diplomats in Havana.

This won't be news to anyone with half an ounce of sense, but I suspect a number of this boards more notoriously progressive posters will be genuinely shocked at the suggestion that Moore could possibly have made it all up :devil:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org


Never saw it.

Given that my wife and her sister have been in health care for over 35 years each, with my wife complaining about the descent of health care into chaos, in the US, for the last 25 years, not to mention the nightmare that our family went through for six years with my mother, I don't need Moore to tell me the system isn't working.
 


talk2glenn said:
Has Assange proven himself useful, after all?
Useful for what? He didn't get the movie banned in Cuba. You mean useful for poking a finger in the eye of Democrats? Republicans already knew Sicko was propaganda and Democrats don't care. So this doesn't change anything for anyone.
 


Ivan Seeking said:
Given that my wife and her sister have been in health care for over 35 years each, with my wife complaining about the descent of health care into chaos, in the US, for the last 25 years, not to mention the nightmare that our family went through for six years with my mother, I don't need Moore to tell me the system isn't working.
Hmm. My girlfriend's brother just got a new heart valve at CHOP and except for the urinay catheter was apparently a pretty pleasant experience.

No two people have exactly the same experience.
 


russ_watters said:
Hmm. My girlfriend's brother just got a new heart valve at CHOP and except for the urinay catheter was apparently a pretty pleasant experience.

No two people have exactly the same experience.
While I generally agree with the last sentence, I believe someone who is working in the industry over a few decades has direct knowledge of several hundreds or thousands of individual cases, and is therefore able to speak from a more statistically significant set of experiences than say, a single user who has had a single interaction with the industry.

Nevertheless, I'd much rather have an objective scientific study than thousands of anecdotes.

PS: Not getting the Assange reference.

PS2: Just read the article. Previous PS rescinded.
 
Last edited:


I'm also missing the Assange reference, and also nonplussed. Who cares that this happened when it was always laughable in the first place? Yes, our system is terribly broken, but Cuba is an absolute ****hole for the average citizen.
 


The revelation, contained in a confidential US embassy cable released by WikiLeaks

He's the one that "leaked" this. I'm not sure how a movie being banned could possibly not be public knowledge though
 


This story is currently playing out, and it will be interesting to see how the mainstream press covers it. According to Moore himself, the film was shown on Cuban national TV on April 25, 2008 (both the Cubavision Roundtable and the Education Channels) and subsequently was released in theatrical screenings.

Moore claims that the leaked cable claiming his movie was banned was propaganda aimed at discrediting his film. We'll see.
 
The film was indeed shown on April 25, 2008 at 5:50pm by the Canal Educativo. That is not Michael Moore making that claim; that is Cuban newspapers making that claim. Here are the links, in Spanish language:

http://www.cubasi.cu/desktopdefault.aspx?spk=160&clk=195482&lk=1&ck=100358&spka=35

http://www.juventudrebelde.cu/cuba/...reno-del-documental-sicko-en-la-mesa-redonda/

http://www.juventudrebelde.cu/opinion/2010-07-15/el-proximo-bocado/

I find it truly amazing that people actually believe Cuba would ban a movie that makes them look good when compared to the US. The critical thinking process "flew out the window." Truly unbelievable... Cuba, a nation we are told uses propaganda to control its population, "banned" "propaganda" that portrays Cuba in a beneficial way... and people eat it up!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #10
Mathnomalous said:
The film was indeed shown on April 25, 2008 at 5:50pm by the Canal Educativo. That is not Michael Moore making that claim; that is Cuban newspapers making that claim. Here are the links, in Spanish language:

http://www.cubasi.cu/desktopdefault.aspx?spk=160&clk=195482&lk=1&ck=100358&spka=35

http://www.juventudrebelde.cu/cuba/...reno-del-documental-sicko-en-la-mesa-redonda/

http://www.juventudrebelde.cu/opinion/2010-07-15/el-proximo-bocado/

I find it truly amazing that people actually believe Cuba would ban a movie that makes them look good when compared to the US. The critical thinking process "flew out the window." Truly unbelievable... Cuba, a nation we are told uses propaganda to control its population, "banned" "propaganda" that portrays Cuba in a beneficial way... and people eat it up!

It sound as if there might be more to the story - perhaps the Cubans thought they were going to be the beneficiaries of "Cuban Health Care Reform"? LOL
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #11


russ_watters said:
Hmm. My girlfriend's brother just got a new heart valve at CHOP and except for the urinay catheter was apparently a pretty pleasant experience.

No two people have exactly the same experience.

True, one my mother's 7 surgeries and my dad's 6 went pretty well too. Of course mom is crippled and dad is dead, but it wasn't all bad.

No doubt about it though, they have heart surgery down to a fine art. The biggest problems we saw were the result of a lack of continuity of care as the patients get bounced around in the system. This nearly killed my mother several times, and it did ruin her life.

Luckily they both had good insurance.
 
Last edited:
  • #12


Gokul43201 said:
Nevertheless, I'd much rather have an objective scientific study than thousands of anecdotes.

I'm not sure anyone knows how to measure the misery of patients and the families trying to cope with the system.
 
  • #13


I'm quite sure no one tracked the years that my mother suffered horribly, and needlessly.
 
  • #14


Ivan Seeking said:
I'm not sure anyone knows how to measure the misery of patients and the families trying to cope with the system.

I just spent a week in a hospital ICU with a family member. Walking around and sitting in the room, I took note of some features.
1.) the hospital had new equipment in the room - no obvious need for improvement - all good.
2.) the hospital had obviously invested countless $ millions on the look of the facility and visitor comfort - large HDTV's in every room, plus plush sofas and lounge chairs, and tables and chairs. The family lounge had sleeper sofas, large HDTV, and showers. The hospital looked more like a hotel than a healthcare facility. Btw - the lobby had artwork, several fountains and a wall mounted waterfall.
 
  • #15


Gokul43201 said:
While I generally agree with the last sentence, I believe someone who is working in the industry over a few decades has direct knowledge of several hundreds or thousands of individual cases, and is therefore able to speak from a more statistically significant set of experiences than say, a single user who has had a single interaction with the industry.
Maybe, but it is also true that the healthcare worker is looking at those cases from the other side of the fence and may not have the same perception as the patients and their families. However...
Nevertheless, I'd much rather have an objective scientific study than thousands of anecdotes.
Agreed, especially since people with a personal stake in the issue lack objectivity required to judge it fairly. I don't know my girlfriend's family's true feelings, but I know they disliked some of the doctors and the situation was pretty emotional/stressful so their take might have differed from mine as a somewhat disinterested 3rd party.

As well, the healtcare worker's stake in the issue is tied to the day-to-day stresses of the job. Bad experiences have a way to stick-out and build-up while good experiences aren't always "newsworthy" and given as much thought.

Either way, yes, an objective 3rd party study is the best way to judge... but judge what? I'm actually not even sure what the exact debate point is and I don't want to get into a big healthcare debate anyway.
 
  • #16


talk2glenn said:
The Cubans banned the Michael Moore propaganda piece because it painted too rosy a picture of the local healthcare system, which no Cuban would have believed, according to the State Department. Apparently a group of Cuban doctors who were allowed by Dear Fidel to watch the "documentary" were so upset by the distortions that they walked out! This sounds like satire, I know, but apparently its true. Too rich.

Heavens to Murgatroyd! You mean Michael Moore actually distorts reality in his films? (insert shocked look of disbelieving horror)

(faints)

This won't be news to anyone with half an ounce of sense...

Of course not, Lol.

...but I suspect a number of this boards more notoriously progressive posters will be genuinely shocked at the suggestion that Moore could possibly have made it all up :devil:

I find it difficult to believe that intelligent, thinking, well-educated human beings could possibly throw such vast amounts of common sense out the window as to buy into Mr. Moore's babble. He may start off with a shred of truth, or dangle bits and pieces here and there like worms on a hook to keep someone's attention, but that's all.
 
Last edited:
  • #17


WhoWee said:
I just spent a week in a hospital ICU with a family member. Walking around and sitting in the room, I took note of some features.
1.) the hospital had new equipment in the room - no obvious need for improvement - all good.
2.) the hospital had obviously invested countless $ millions on the look of the facility and visitor comfort - large HDTV's in every room, plus plush sofas and lounge chairs, and tables and chairs. The family lounge had sleeper sofas, large HDTV, and showers. The hospital looked more like a hotel than a healthcare facility. Btw - the lobby had artwork, several fountains and a wall mounted waterfall.

When too many hospitals are built and facilities are underused (bed utilization here in the Springs is often less than 50%), staying afloat requires coaxing those who's medical expenses are covered by insurance in full, and to do that, they must spent boatloads making the hospitals more attractive. The downside is that this raises the cost of healthcare insurance for everyone (insurance is largely spread out over the population), to the point where many can no longer afford it at all.
 
Last edited:
  • #18


mugaliens said:
Heavens to Murgatroyd! You mean Michael Moore actually distorts reality in his films? (insert shocked look of disbelieving horror)

(faints)



Of course not, Lol.



I find it difficult to believe that intelligent, thinking, well-educated human beings could possibly throw such vast amounts of common sense out the window as to buy into Mr. Moore's babble. He may start off with a shred of truth, or dangle bits and pieces here and there like worms on a hook to keep someone's attention, but that's all.

I would tend to agree, and I'm not seeing this wave of support for the guy on PF or elsewhere. He had an interesting point in Bowling For Columbine, but that was a loooong time and too many riffs on new themes. Much as a comic is spoiled by the birth of a child (usually), I think documentarians are destroyed by too much success.
 
  • #19


Regardless of any "wave" or lack of support for Michael Moore here or anywhere else, it seems like a lot of right-wingers have been anxious to trumpet and repeat (ad nauseum) the claim that Moore's movie was banned in Cuba because it was too generous in portraying Cuba's health-care system as effective. The claim was ignorant, and is being exposed as such.

This crap has been spreading all over the right-wing blogosphere as if it were the gospel truth. And every repeating seems to use the same verbiage verbatim over and over. Is there not a single right-wing mouthpiece that could have spent a few seconds on Google to see if Sicko was actually aired in Cuba (on two national channels, no less), or to have investigated whether Sicko actually got theatrical release and multiple airings after the TV exposure?

What is the problem, people? Are Cubans failed humans? Are they creeps or sociopaths? Maybe we need our media to grow a pair.
 
  • #20


turbo-1 said:
What is the problem, people? Are Cubans failed humans? Are they creeps or sociopaths?
The Cuban leadership is.
 
  • #21


Idunno what to believe anymore.

Michael Moore says it wasn't.

State says it was.

Conflicting news stories all around. Either way, the whole affair is rich. This has been the brightest spot in my weekend, I think. Either way, I win. Either it was banned, and Michael Moore is utterly discredited, or it wasn't, and State had the prescience to know that it's classified cables would be leaked years in advance, and falsified the record to discredit Moore in 2010.

Regardless of any "wave" or lack of support for Michael Moore here or anywhere else, it seems like a lot of right-wingers have been anxious to trumpet and repeat (ad nauseum) the claim that Moore's movie was banned in Cuba because it was too generous in portraying Cuba's health-care system as effective. The claim was ignorant, and is being exposed as such.

My source was the Guardian, hardly a bastion of right-wingerism. This story is mainstream, my friend, and goes back to 2007, apparently.

http://www.google.com/search?q=Cuba...=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=a20cfd04ba3c5cf9

Again, I still don't know what to think, but here's what it looks like. The film was not shown until mid-April 2008, well after anecdotal stories regarding a ban or censure had made their way through Western media. I'm also going to guess that the State memos pre-date these showings as well.

My guess is the Cuban government, to wipe the egg off of their faces, responded to the news by lifting the censure. This is speculation, of course, but the alternative makes no sense (how does State mentioning the ban in classified cables smear Moore's reputation, and what incentive or means does State have to do so - it's not an intelligence organization).
 
  • #22


turbo-1 said:
Regardless of any "wave" or lack of support for Michael Moore here or anywhere else, it seems like a lot of right-wingers have been anxious to trumpet and repeat (ad nauseum) the claim that Moore's movie was banned in Cuba because it was too generous in portraying Cuba's health-care system as effective. The claim was ignorant, and is being exposed as such.

This crap has been spreading all over the right-wing blogosphere as if it were the gospel truth. And every repeating seems to use the same verbiage verbatim over and over. Is there not a single right-wing mouthpiece that could have spent a few seconds on Google to see if Sicko was actually aired in Cuba (on two national channels, no less), or to have investigated whether Sicko actually got theatrical release and multiple airings after the TV exposure?

What is the problem, people? Are Cubans failed humans? Are they creeps or sociopaths? Maybe we need our media to grow a pair.

I'm not sure if you're defending the Cuban health care system or just on another rant about "the right wing" - care to clarify?

Do you honestly believe Moore was accurate in his presentation and that ALL Cubans enjoy the same benefits and treatment?
 
  • #23


mheslep said:
The Cuban leadership is.

All leaders are creeps and sociopaths... the Cuban leadership is actually criminal and psychotic... way past the usual.
 
  • #24


I agree with Mathnomalous post #9. It doesn't make sense that Cuba would turn down propaganda that benefits them while making the US look bad in comparison.
 
  • #25


nismaratwork said:
All leaders are creeps and sociopaths...
That's a pretty broad brush there...all leaders?
the Cuban leadership is actually criminal and psychotic... way past the usual.
+1. I've often wondered why some rich American hasn't privately come to the defense of the Cuban people and took those "psychotic" leaders out.

Ross Perot maybe? He's a nutcase, but I love how he hired people to bust his employees out of Iranian prison.
 
  • #26


WhoWee said:
I'm not sure if you're defending the Cuban health care system or just on another rant about "the right wing" - care to clarify?

Do you honestly believe Moore was accurate in his presentation and that ALL Cubans enjoy the same benefits and treatment?
I made no such assertions. I'm just disgusted that the "banning" story could be repeated over and over when a few minutes of research could have cleared it all up. Mathnomalous managed to dig up stories in Cuban print archives about the premier showing of Sicko on Cuban state TV channels. Where are all the "journalists" who should have been exercising due diligence before rushing to print?
 
  • #27


Amp1 said:
I agree with Mathnomalous post #9. It doesn't make sense that Cuba would turn down propaganda that benefits them while making the US look bad in comparison.
+1. Moore's film was pro-communist propaganda. Cuba's communist regime couldn't ask for much better.
 
  • #28


I think M. Moore is a liar and a hypocrite (why would I have to pay money to see your film about how much capitalism sucks, Mr. Moore? :rolleyes:). Still, I do not understand why some US official in La Habana felt it necessary to spread lies about a liar and I simply shake my head at irresponsible news outlets trying to rush news out without fact-checking. All these news outlets needed to do was Google "sicko prohibido cuba" to fact-check that info.

On a related note, when will Fidel kick the bucket?
 
  • #29


turbo-1 said:
...it seems like a lot of right-wingers have been anxious to trumpet and repeat (ad nauseum) the claim that Moore's movie was banned in Cuba because it was too generous in portraying Cuba's health-care system as effective...This crap has been spreading all over the right-wing blogosphere as if it were the gospel truth.
Can you provide any links for those claims? Why would right-wingers want to go out of their way to say that Cuba's communist regime didn't approve of Moore's pro-communist propaganda?

The fact that the communist regime approved of Moore's propaganda piece seems far more advantageous for "right-wing mouthpieces".
 
  • #30
Mathnomalous said:
On a related note, when will Fidel kick the bucket?

Not for a while. I understand his medical care is top-notch.

I have four bottles of champagne chilling in the fridge. One of them gets popped on Dead Fidel day.
 
  • #31


Antiphon said:
Not for a while. I understand his medical care is top-notch.

I have four bottles of champagne chilling in the fridge. One of them gets popped on Dead Fidel day.
What about the other three? Chavez?
 
  • #32


Al68 said:
What about the other three? Chavez?

I think Chavez and his regime have become genuinely dangerous to the region. His new ability to create law by decree is a terrible step for such an industrialized nation. When we finally get out of the middle east and accept that it's hopeless, we're going to realize we've really ignored our own sphere.
 
  • #33
Al68 said:
What about the other three? Chavez?

Yes; Chavez, Kim Jong Il, and Jimmy Carter for creating the Iranian monster, shooting his girlfriend's cat, and being a reliable Jew-hater.
 
  • #34


Antiphon said:
Yes; Chavez, Kim Jong Il, and Jimmy Carter for creating the Iranian monster, shooting his girlfriend's cat, and being a reliable Jew-hater.

Ouch...I figure anything Jimmy says or does is brother Billy's fault.
 
  • #35


nismaratwork said:
All leaders are creeps and sociopaths... the Cuban leadership is actually criminal and psychotic... way past the usual.
Nihilism? I think you'll find that's illusory and a dead end.
 
  • #36


Mathnomalous said:
I think M. Moore is a liar and a hypocrite (why would I have to pay money to see your film about how much capitalism sucks, Mr. Moore? :rolleyes:). Still, I do not understand why some US official in La Habana felt it necessary to spread lies about a liar and I simply shake my head at irresponsible news outlets trying to rush news out without fact-checking. All these news outlets needed to do was Google "sicko prohibido cuba" to fact-check that info.
How do you know the cables are lies, and that you are simply looking at two different places in time?
https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=3044270&postcount=21
 
  • #37


mheslep said:
Nihilism? I think you'll find that's illusory and a dead end.

Wow, I am nowhere near a nihilist... that's reading something into what I said that just isn't there. I can accept that the people who WANT political power, are willing and able to get it, tend to be on the sociopath8ic end of things. As for creeps...

Anyway, the result may not be paradise, but I don't see how deconstructing society and expecting the same to somehow NOT re-emerge naturally is naive and a bit mad. Why is it so hard to believe I'm exactly what I say: skeptical, wary, but not an ideologue either. Maybe as one of the truly arch conservatives here you simply dislike what you see as a liberal view and feel the need to label it?
 
  • #38
mheslep said:
How do you know the cables are lies, and that you are simply looking at two different places in time?
https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=3044270&postcount=21
How about a story from the AP back in 2007?

http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2007/06/16/2007-06-16_moores_sicko_gets_nod_from_cuba.html

Cuba's health minister said Friday that American filmmaker Michael Moore's documentary "Sicko" highlights the human values of the island's communist-run government.

Moore flew to Cuba in March to obtain health care for three ailing Sept. 11 rescue workers as part of the documentary, which calls for an overhaul of America's health care system. The trip has been the subject of a U.S. federal investigation for possible violations of the U.S. trade embargo restricting travel to Cuba.

Speaking to reporters at a Havana event, Health Minister Jose Ramon Balaguer did not say if he had seen the movie or was simply relying on snippets that have aired on international television. "Sicko" debuted at the Cannes Film Festival in May, but does not open in U.S. theaters until June 29.

Still, Balaguer said that in the movie "Moore explained his reasons why those patients were attended to in our country," adding that Cuba is "always open to cases, that, from a human point of view, need our public health services."

He said the film does not serve to "promote" Cuban health care, but conceded "there can be no doubt this documentary by a personality like Mr. Michael Moore helps promote the profoundly human principles of Cuban society."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2007/06/16/2007-06-16_moores_sicko_gets_nod_from_cuba.html#ixzz18cFIaFse

One would have to concoct a pretty complex conspiracy in order to believe that the State Department cable was accurate and that Sicko was banned in Cuba.
 
  • #39
turbo-1 said:
How about a story from the AP back in 2007?

http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2007/06/16/2007-06-16_moores_sicko_gets_nod_from_cuba.html



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/2007/06/16/2007-06-16_moores_sicko_gets_nod_from_cuba.html#ixzz18cFIaFse

One would have to concoct a pretty complex conspiracy in order to believe that the State Department cable was accurate and that Sicko was banned in Cuba.

"Snippets" is not exactly a smoking gun?
 
  • #40


turbo-1 said:
How about a story from the AP back in 2007?
How about it?


One would have to concoct a pretty complex conspiracy in order to believe that the State Department cable was accurate and that Sicko was banned in Cuba.
Was banned ... when? Again, the possibility that the cable is referring to a different point in time does not require any conspiracy theory.
 
  • #41


I think it was banned for the graphic sex scene with Moore and a young Cuban lad. *deadpan*
 
  • #42


nismaratwork said:
I think it was banned for the graphic sex scene with Moore and a young Cuban lad. *deadpan*
That's how the lad got his surgery paid for. Did you think it was really free?
 
  • #43
Has no one bothered to look? It wasn't banned in cuba, ever.
here is the article in the state sponsored newspaper...surely a piece of propaganda... I just couldn't figure out what it would be for.

http://www.5septiembre.cu/index.php/internacionales/47-noticias/12821-iviva-wikileaks-qsickoq-no-fue-prohibido-en-cuba

and if you don't speak Spanish.

WikiLeaks did something amazing yesterday and issued a classified cable to the State Department was, in part, about me and my film, "Sicko" .
It is an awesome look to the Orwellian nature of how state bureaucrats spin their lies and trying to recreate reality (I guess to appease their bosses and tell them what they want to hear).
The date is January 31, 2008. Just days after Sicko was nominated for an Oscar as Best Documentary. This must have gone mad at someone in the Bush State Department (the Treasury Department was immediately notified me that they were investigating what laws could be broken by taking three of the first rescue workers to Cuba on November 11 to be given the care that was denied in the United States).
Former health insurance executive, Wendell Potter , recently revealed that the insurance industry, which had decided to spend millions to go against me and, if necessary , "Michael Moore to push off a cliff" - had begun working with the anti-Castro Cubans in Miami to get them to talk to who slandered my film .
Thus, the January 31, 2008, a State Department official stationed in Havana took an invented story and sent it back to its headquarters in Washington. This is what they suggested:


XXXXXXXXXXXX said that Cuban authorities have banned Michael Moore's documentary, "Sicko," to be subversive. Although the intention of the film is to discredit the health system in the U.S., highlighting the excellence of the Cuban system, said the regime knows that the film is a myth and does not want to risk a popular backlash to show Cubans facilities that are clearly not available for the vast majority of them.


Sounds convincing huh? Only one problem: all the people of Cuba saw the film on national television on April 25, 2008! The Cubans liked the movie became one of those rare American movies that received a theatrical distribution Cuba. Personally, I took a copy of 35 mm reached the Instituto de Cine de La Habana.
The screening of "Sicko" was held in cities throughout the country. . But the secret cable said that Cubans are banned from seeing my movie. Hmmm.
We also know from other U.S. secret document "The disappointment of the [masses in Cuba] has spread to all provinces" and that "the whole province of East is seething with hatred" against the Castro regime. There is a large active underground rebellion, and "workers easily give all necessary support" to everyone involved in a "subtle sabotage" against the government. The morale is terrible in all branches of the armed forces, and if war the army "will not fight." Tremendo - this cable is hot!
Of course, the U.S. secret cable is 31 March 1961 , three weeks before Cuba kicked some *** in the Bay of Pigs.
The U.S. government has been happening these documents "secret" to himself in the last fifty years, explaining in minute detail how terrible is the situation in Cuba and how the Cubans are suffering in silence so that we can go back and take control. Do not know why we write these cables, I guess it just makes us feel better about ourselves. (Anyone curious can find a museum full of wish-fulfillment leads the U.S. in the website of the National Security Archive.)
So what to do with a fake cable almost "secret", especially one that involves you and the film? Well, you expect a responsible newspaper to investigate and to shout from the rooftops what you discover.
But WikiLeaks was yesterday released on cable "Sicko" in Cuba to the media - and what they did to him? They did move as if it were true! Here's the headline in the newspaper The Guardian : "WikiLeaks: Cuba Sicko banned by describing" a mythical 'health system. The authorities feared that images of gleaming hospitals in the film of Michael Moore, nominated for an Oscar, provoked a reaction popular. "
And none of a thorough investigation to see if Cuba had banned the film really! In fact, quite the contrary. The right-wing press began to have a field day reporting a lie ( Andy Levy , Fox - twice - RevistaReason and Hot Air , and a lot of blogs ). Unfortunately, even BoingBoing and friends of The Nation wrote about it without skepticism. So here we have to WikiLeaks, which has been on line to find and release these wires to the press - and mainstream journalists, once again too lazy to lift a finger, pointing and clicking the mouse to access Nexis or search through Google and see if Cuba really "banned the film." If only a reporter would have done this, this is what was found:


June 16, 2007 Saturday 1:41 GMT [ie seven months before the fake cable]

HEADLINE: Cuban Health Minister said that Michael Moore's film Sicko shows "human values" of a communist system.

Byline: By ANDREA RODRIGUEZ, Associated Press Writer

LA HABANA

Health Minister Jose Ramon Balaguer Cuba, said on Friday that U.S. documentary filmmaker Michael Moore "Sicko" highlights the human values of the communist government of the island ... "There can be no doubt that this documentary is a personality like Mr. Michael Moore helps promote the profoundly human principles of Cuban society.


How about this little news of April 25, 2008 in Cubasi.cu (Google translation):


Sicko premiered in Cuba 25/04/2008
The documentary Sicko, American filmmaker Michael Moore, which is about the deplorable state of U.S. health care system will be released today at 5:50 pm, in the space Cubavisión Roundtable and the Education Channel.


Then there is this from JuventudRebelde.cu . Or the Cuban publishing . There is even a long clip of Cuba section that appears in 'Sicko' on the multimedia page website Cubasi.cu in the channel Roundtable .
OK, we know that the media are lazy and most will not work. But the biggest problem here is how our government seemed to be in collusion with the health insurance industry to destroy a film that could lend a hand to induce what the Cubans are in a third world country ravaged by poverty: health free and universal. And because they have it and we do not, Cuba has a rate of infant mortality lower than ours , their life expectancy is only seven months below ours, and, according to the WHO, are ranked just two places behind the richest country in the world in terms of quality medical care.
This is history, so you know the mainstream media and the enemies of right.
Now that you have presented the facts, what are you going to do about it? Going to attack me because my film was screened at the Cuban state television? Or do they attack me because my film projected on Cuban state television?
Have to choose one, can not be both.
And since the facts show that the film was screened on national television and in cinemas, I think it's better than attacking me for having my film screened in Cuba.

WikiLeaks Viva!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #44
christopherV said:
Has no one bothered to look? It wasn't banned in cuba, ever.
here is the article in the state sponsored newspaper...surely a piece of propaganda... I just couldn't figure out what it would be for.

http://www.5septiembre.cu/index.php/internacionales/47-noticias/12821-iviva-wikileaks-qsickoq-no-fue-prohibido-en-cuba

and if you don't speak Spanish.

WikiLeaks did something amazing yesterday and issued a classified cable to the State Department was, in part, about me and my film, "Sicko" .
It is an awesome look to the Orwellian nature of how state bureaucrats spin their lies and trying to recreate reality (I guess to appease their bosses and tell them what they want to hear).
The date is January 31, 2008. Just days after Sicko was nominated for an Oscar as Best Documentary. This must have gone mad at someone in the Bush State Department (the Treasury Department was immediately notified me that they were investigating what laws could be broken by taking three of the first rescue workers to Cuba on November 11 to be given the care that was denied in the United States).
Former health insurance executive, Wendell Potter , recently revealed that the insurance industry, which had decided to spend millions to go against me and, if necessary , "Michael Moore to push off a cliff" - had begun working with the anti-Castro Cubans in Miami to get them to talk to who slandered my film .
Thus, the January 31, 2008, a State Department official stationed in Havana took an invented story and sent it back to its headquarters in Washington. This is what they suggested:


XXXXXXXXXXXX said that Cuban authorities have banned Michael Moore's documentary, "Sicko," to be subversive. Although the intention of the film is to discredit the health system in the U.S., highlighting the excellence of the Cuban system, said the regime knows that the film is a myth and does not want to risk a popular backlash to show Cubans facilities that are clearly not available for the vast majority of them.


Sounds convincing huh? Only one problem: all the people of Cuba saw the film on national television on April 25, 2008! The Cubans liked the movie became one of those rare American movies that received a theatrical distribution Cuba. Personally, I took a copy of 35 mm reached the Instituto de Cine de La Habana.
The screening of "Sicko" was held in cities throughout the country. . But the secret cable said that Cubans are banned from seeing my movie. Hmmm.
We also know from other U.S. secret document "The disappointment of the [masses in Cuba] has spread to all provinces" and that "the whole province of East is seething with hatred" against the Castro regime. There is a large active underground rebellion, and "workers easily give all necessary support" to everyone involved in a "subtle sabotage" against the government. The morale is terrible in all branches of the armed forces, and if war the army "will not fight." Tremendo - this cable is hot!
Of course, the U.S. secret cable is 31 March 1961 , three weeks before Cuba kicked some *** in the Bay of Pigs.
The U.S. government has been happening these documents "secret" to himself in the last fifty years, explaining in minute detail how terrible is the situation in Cuba and how the Cubans are suffering in silence so that we can go back and take control. Do not know why we write these cables, I guess it just makes us feel better about ourselves. (Anyone curious can find a museum full of wish-fulfillment leads the U.S. in the website of the National Security Archive.)
So what to do with a fake cable almost "secret", especially one that involves you and the film? Well, you expect a responsible newspaper to investigate and to shout from the rooftops what you discover.
But WikiLeaks was yesterday released on cable "Sicko" in Cuba to the media - and what they did to him? They did move as if it were true! Here's the headline in the newspaper The Guardian : "WikiLeaks: Cuba Sicko banned by describing" a mythical 'health system. The authorities feared that images of gleaming hospitals in the film of Michael Moore, nominated for an Oscar, provoked a reaction popular. "
And none of a thorough investigation to see if Cuba had banned the film really! In fact, quite the contrary. The right-wing press began to have a field day reporting a lie ( Andy Levy , Fox - twice - RevistaReason and Hot Air , and a lot of blogs ). Unfortunately, even BoingBoing and friends of The Nation wrote about it without skepticism. So here we have to WikiLeaks, which has been on line to find and release these wires to the press - and mainstream journalists, once again too lazy to lift a finger, pointing and clicking the mouse to access Nexis or search through Google and see if Cuba really "banned the film." If only a reporter would have done this, this is what was found:


June 16, 2007 Saturday 1:41 GMT [ie seven months before the fake cable]

HEADLINE: Cuban Health Minister said that Michael Moore's film Sicko shows "human values" of a communist system.

Byline: By ANDREA RODRIGUEZ, Associated Press Writer

LA HABANA

Health Minister Jose Ramon Balaguer Cuba, said on Friday that U.S. documentary filmmaker Michael Moore "Sicko" highlights the human values of the communist government of the island ... "There can be no doubt that this documentary is a personality like Mr. Michael Moore helps promote the profoundly human principles of Cuban society.


How about this little news of April 25, 2008 in Cubasi.cu (Google translation):


Sicko premiered in Cuba 25/04/2008
The documentary Sicko, American filmmaker Michael Moore, which is about the deplorable state of U.S. health care system will be released today at 5:50 pm, in the space Cubavisión Roundtable and the Education Channel.


Then there is this from JuventudRebelde.cu . Or the Cuban publishing . There is even a long clip of Cuba section that appears in 'Sicko' on the multimedia page website Cubasi.cu in the channel Roundtable .
OK, we know that the media are lazy and most will not work. But the biggest problem here is how our government seemed to be in collusion with the health insurance industry to destroy a film that could lend a hand to induce what the Cubans are in a third world country ravaged by poverty: health free and universal. And because they have it and we do not, Cuba has a rate of infant mortality lower than ours , their life expectancy is only seven months below ours, and, according to the WHO, are ranked just two places behind the richest country in the world in terms of quality medical care.
This is history, so you know the mainstream media and the enemies of right.
Now that you have presented the facts, what are you going to do about it? Going to attack me because my film was screened at the Cuban state television? Or do they attack me because my film projected on Cuban state television?
Have to choose one, can not be both.
And since the facts show that the film was screened on national television and in cinemas, I think it's better than attacking me for having my film screened in Cuba.

WikiLeaks Viva!

Welcome to PF Michael Moore? (Don't worry about the rules - there's probably no need to support anything you post.)

If that's really you Michael, I have a request (make it a suggestion) for your next film. Why don't you do an in-depth, item by item, comparison of the benefits of the US welfare system to the Cuban system. Let's not limit the focus to medical - it doesn't tell the whole story.

Instead, why not look at housing, food, education, transportation, communication, sanitation, utilities, legal representation, prison conditions, unemployment, jobs training, farm subsidy, disability income, retirement income, investment protection, national security, and property rights. Basically, take EVERY department of the US and compare it to it's Cuban equivalent. I'm quite sure if you take your time, do extensive research and present an honest look at both systems - average people in both countries will be surprised and impressed with your work.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #45


WhoWee said:
Welcome to PF Michael Moore? (Don't worry about the rules - there's probably no need to support anything you post.)

If that's really you Michael, I have a request (make it a suggestion) for your next film. Why don't you do an in-depth, item by item, comparison of the benefits of the US welfare system to the Cuban system. Let's not limit the focus to medical - it doesn't tell the whole story.

Instead, why not look at housing, food, education, transportation, communication, sanitation, utilities, legal representation, prison conditions, unemployment, jobs training, farm subsidy, disability income, retirement income, investment protection, national security, and property rights. Basically, take EVERY department of the US and compare it to it's Cuban equivalent. I'm quite sure if you take your time, do extensive research and present an honest look at both systems - average people in both countries will be surprised and impressed with your work.

Not Moore... Chris just isn't very good about formatting quotes. The "my film" bit is part of a quote from Moore, as is most of what was posted... just not in quotes.
 
  • #46


talk2glenn said:
[...] This sounds like satire, I know, but apparently its true. Too rich.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/17/wikileaks-cuba-banned-sicko


This won't be news to anyone with half an ounce of sense, [...]

The Guardian have removed their story from this link and issued the following correction:

Contrary to a claim made in a leaked US diplomatic cable whose contents we reported, Sicko – a documentary by film-maker Michael Moore – was not banned in Cuba. The film, which examines US healthcare through comparisons with some countries' publicly funded systems, including Cuba's, was in fact shown in film theatres throughout the island and on national TV.


Here is the original cable:

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2008/01/08HAVANA103.html

Here is the Guardian's current take: WikiLeaks cables: Michael Moore film Sicko was 'not banned' in Cuba. It seems to be pieced together mostly from the cable itself and Michael Moore's http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/mike-friends-blog/viva-wikileaks .
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #47


nismaratwork said:
Not Moore... Chris just isn't very good about formatting quotes. The "my film" bit is part of a quote from Moore, as is most of what was posted... just not in quotes.

Too bad, I thought my idea for a movie might cause him to find the truth.
 
  • #48


WhoWee said:
Too bad, I thought my idea for a movie might cause him to find the truth.

Moore couldn't find truth if it funded his movie, called it, "I Found The Truth: The Movie". That guy is not interested in much beyond self-aggrandizement from what I can see.
 
Back
Top