What is the earliest depiction of a telescope in a painting?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the historical depiction and development of telescopes, particularly focusing on early representations in paintings and their origins. Participants explore various historical references, including notable figures and their contributions to the invention and improvement of telescopes, as well as the timeline of these developments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Historical
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference Jan Brueghel the Elder's paintings from 1608 to 1625, suggesting that they depict some of the earliest spyglasses, with one painting potentially representing the first depiction of a telescope.
  • Others mention the contributions of Hans Lippershey and Zacharias Janssen in the development of refracting telescopes in 1608, noting that Galileo improved these designs shortly thereafter.
  • A participant introduces the Hockney-Falco thesis, linking it to historical optics and mentioning figures like John Dee and Thomas Digges, who referred to perspective glasses and contributed to early telescope design.
  • Another post suggests that the origins of telescopes could be traced back to around 1000 AD, referencing an article that supports this claim.
  • Some participants express a general belief that the Dutch were pivotal in the development of telescopes around 1600, while acknowledging the challenges of working with lenses historically.
  • A participant shares enthusiasm for telescopes and mentions a personal interest in collecting antique telescopes, linking to a resource on the developmental history of telescopes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the origins and early representations of telescopes, with no clear consensus on the earliest depiction or the timeline of developments. Multiple competing perspectives remain regarding the contributions of various historical figures and the significance of different artifacts.

Contextual Notes

Some claims about the timeline and contributions are based on historical interpretations that may depend on specific definitions or assumptions about what constitutes a telescope. There are unresolved aspects regarding the accuracy of early depictions and the technological capabilities of the time.

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http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0908/0908.2696v1.pdf

Abstract. Several early spyglasses are depicted in five paintings by Jan Brueghel the Elder
completed between 1608 and 1625, as he was court painter of Archduke Albert VII of
Habsburg. An optical tube that appears in the Extensive Landscape with View of the Castle
of Mariemont, dated 1608-1612, represents the first painting of a telescope whatsoever. We
collected some documents showing that Albert VII obtained spyglasses very early directly
from Lipperhey or Sacharias Janssen. Thus the painting likely reproduces one of the first
man-made telescopes ever. Two other instruments appear in two Allegories of Sight made
in the years 1617 and 1618. These are sophisticated instruments and the structure suggests
that they may be keplerian, but this is about two decades ahead this mounting was in use.

From Wiki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescope

The earliest evidence of working telescopes were the refracting telescopes that appeared in the Netherlands in 1608. Their development is credited to three individuals: Hans Lippershey and Zacharias Janssen, who were spectacle makers in Middelburg, and Jacob Metius of Alkmaar.[4] Galileo greatly improved upon these designs the following year.

The idea that a mirror could be used as an objective instead of a lens was being investigated soon after the invention of the refracting telescope.[5] The potential advantages of using parabolic mirrors, primarily reduction of spherical aberration with no chromatic aberration, led to many proposed designs and several attempts to build reflecting telescopes.[6] In 1668, Isaac Newton built the first practical reflecting telescope that bears his name, the Newtonian reflector.
 
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A little unrelated, but possibly interesting is the Hockney-Falco thesis, with other considerations about optics historically.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hockney–Falco_thesis

More relatedly, John Dee and Thomas Digges referred to perspective glasses.

'In 1554 a group of Oxonians invited John Dee of St. John's College, Cambridge, to come and lecture in Oxford. He refused, but his pupil Thomas Digges of Queens' College, Cambridge, came instead. He was the first English author to describe the theodolite and he edited the works of his father, Leonard Digges (University College, Oxford), who was the first maker of efficient telescopes.'

http://www.maths.ox.ac.uk/about/history
 
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Nice. I'd thought there was something more interesting than what I had posted, but couldn't think of it.
 
Yes I'd always learned is twas the Dutch around 1600 - but it's difficult to play around with lenses (like alhazen) and not discover the telescope!
 
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Wow! I love telescopes. Wolram thanks for starting this topic with some great information, and mjb.phd brovo for providing one of my all time favorite links. Fuzzyfelt, enjoyed reading what you provided.

I've been reviewing a great website this past week, thinking about buying an antique telescope. (Love to collect antiques.:smile:) Take a peak at a few of them and browse by scrolling down on the right of the website "The Developmental History of the Telescope" from the On-Line Museum and Encyclopedia of Vision Aids.
http://www.antiquespectacles.com/telescopes/telescopes.htm