A multi-part PMF/joint PMF question

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the probability mass function (PMF) for a random variable \( Z \) defined as \( Z = F(X,Y) = 3X - 2Y \). Participants are exploring how to calculate \( p_Z(z) \) based on given values and relationships between \( X \) and \( Y \). The context includes mathematical reasoning and problem-solving related to probability distributions.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express uncertainty about how to derive \( p_Z(z) \) from the provided values in the table.
  • One participant outlines the function \( F(X,Y) \) and provides specific calculations for \( P(Z=-3) \) and \( P(Z=-1) \), referencing the need for unique pairs of \( (X,Y) \) that yield each \( Z \).
  • Another participant questions the source of certain bracketed terms in the calculations, seeking clarification on their derivation.
  • A participant expresses urgency due to an upcoming exam, indicating a desire for a clearer understanding of the PMF derivation process.
  • Responses include detailed calculations and explanations about the injective nature of the function \( F \) and how it relates to the PMF of \( Z \).

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There is no consensus on the derivation of \( p_Z(z) \) as participants are still seeking clarification and understanding of the calculations involved. Multiple viewpoints and methods are presented without resolution.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference specific values and calculations but do not fully resolve the underlying assumptions or steps necessary for deriving the PMF. There is an indication that the function \( F \) is injective, but the implications of this on the overall calculation process remain partially explored.

nacho-man
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Please refer to the attached image.

for Question 1,
Referring to the solutions, I know how to derive the values of
$z$ in the table, but not of $p_Z(z)$. What have they done there?

View attachment 1610
 

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nacho said:
Please refer to the attached image.

for Question 1,
Referring to the solutions, I know how to derive the values of
$z$ in the table, but not of $p_Z(z)$. What have they done there?

View attachment 1610

First step it to express Z = F (X,Y) = 3 X - 2 Y as function of X and Y...

F(1,1) = 1

F(1,2) = -1

F(1,3) = - 3

F(2,1) = 4

F(2,2) = 2

F(2,3) = 0

F(3,1) = 7

F(3,2) = 5

F(3,3) = 3

Setting P (Z) the PMF of Z we have... P(-3) = 1/84 (1 + 9) = 5/42

P (-1) = 1/84 (1 + 4) = 5/84Are You able to proceed?... Kind regards $\chi$ $\sigma$
 
chisigma said:
First step it to express Z = F (X,Y) = 3 X - 2 Y as function of X and Y...

Setting P (Z) the PMF of Z we have... P(-3) = 1/84 (1 + 9) = 5/42

P (-1) = 1/84 (1 + 4) = 5/84

$\chi$ $\sigma$

where do you get the bracketed terms from, such as (1 + 9) and (1 + 4)
 
Last edited:
Sorry, I know this is bumping and at mhb this is against the rules, but I am really quite desperate (and promise never to do this again).
I was able to do this previously so i know it can't be difficult, I've just forgotten something basic.

but how exactly is $p_Z(z)$ obtained?
I would be so grateful if someone could tell me. I have an exam in two days and don't want to lose easy marks like this !
 
nacho said:
where do you get the bracketed terms from, such as (1 + 9) and (1 + 4)
This is recalculating the values in the first table in the image in post #1. Thus,
\[
P(Z=-3)=P(X=1,Y=3)=p_{X,Y}(1,3)=c(1^2+3^2) =(1+9)/84=10/84
\]
and
\[
P(Z=-1)=P(X=1,Y=2)=p_{X,Y}(1,2)=c(1^2+2^2)= (1+4)/84=5/84
\]
Here it turns out that each value of $Z$ can be produced by one and only one pair of values of $X$ and $Y$, i.e., the function $F$ from post #2 is injective. Therefore, $P(Z=z)=P(X=x,Y=y)$ where $(x,y)$ is the unique pair such that $F(x,y)=z$. If $F$ were not unique, then
\[
P(Z=z)=\sum_{F(x,y)=z}P(X=x,Y=y)
\]
(the sum is over all $(x,y)$ such that $F(x,y)=z$).
 
Thank you so much, I really appreciate that!
 

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