Can History be Modeled as Brownian Motion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the idea of modeling historical events and trends as Brownian motion, particularly in relation to parameters such as corporate revenues and the relative strength of nation states. Participants consider the implications of applying statistical models to these complex systems and the potential for predicting outcomes based on major influencing events.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the "path of history" could be modeled as Brownian motion, questioning if this model applies to large-scale parameters like corporate revenues or nation states' strengths.
  • Others argue that the initial concept is vague and could lead to arbitrary conclusions, suggesting that specific examples like market share or GDP growth rates are more concrete.
  • There is a suggestion that major events, such as stock market shocks or technological breakthroughs, could influence these parameters, leading to a "corrected" Brownian motion model.
  • Some participants express caution regarding the reliability of forecasting models, referencing the success rates of predictions in fields like weather forecasting.
  • One participant mentions the importance of understanding the types of randomness that apply to historical events when modeling them statistically.
  • References to academic papers and literature on related topics, such as power laws and quantitative history, are shared as resources for further exploration.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the applicability and clarity of modeling history as Brownian motion. While some find the concept intriguing, others highlight its vagueness and potential for misleading conclusions. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives on the topic.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in the clarity of definitions and the complexity of the systems being modeled, as well as the unresolved nature of how randomness influences historical events.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in the intersection of history, economics, and statistical modeling, particularly those exploring the implications of randomness and forecasting in complex systems.

chill_factor
Messages
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I read somewhere that the "path of history" measured in some way can be modeled as Brownian motion with a mean collision time.

There's been several very *specific* models such as:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/asm.3150030303/abstract

However, what I'd like to know is that if the same model can be applied to parameters of "big" things that are nonetheless also numerous enough so that the equipartition theorem applies, such as the revenue of a group of major corporations (tens of thousands of them) or even the relative strength of a group of nation states (hundreds).

What'd be really interesting is what the mean collision time is, and what those "collisions" are manifested as.
 
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Sorry, but

chill_factor said:
the "path of history" measured in some way

is so vague it can - in some way - lead to any random conclusion.

Path of getting to this conclusion can be though of as a Brownian motion as well :-p
 
Borek said:
Sorry, but
is so vague it can - in some way - lead to any random conclusion.

Path of getting to this conclusion can be though of as a Brownian motion as well :-p

I made specific examples. market share or stock price of major corporations in an industry for instance. GDP growth rates of nation states is another.

These parameters can be influenced by major events such as a stock market shock or technological breakthrough. I was wondering if it was possible to predict the fortunes of a company or a country while accounting for these major events, a sort of "corrected" Brownian motion through the chosen parameter.
 
chill_factor said:
I made specific examples. market share or stock price of major corporations in an industry for instance. GDP growth rates of nation states is another.

These parameters can be influenced by major events such as a stock market shock or technological breakthrough. I was wondering if it was possible to predict the fortunes of a company or a country while accounting for these major events, a sort of "corrected" Brownian motion through the chosen parameter.

Interesting thought. But be very wary, and maybe do a bit of research of success rate of forecasting with models, weather for instance.

But maybe there is a general semi random pattern in corporation/people/nation cycles, genesis, growth, thriving, high noon/gold age, decay, collapse, termination. Just two cents.
 
chill_factor said:
I read somewhere that the "path of history" measured in some way can be modeled as Brownian motion with a mean collision time.

There are good reasons why the patterns of nature fall into either normal or powerlaw distributions.

The Common Patterns of Nature
Steven A. Frank
June 18, 2009

...any aggregation of processes that preserves information only about the mean and variance attracts to the Gaussian pattern; any aggregation that preserves information only about the mean attracts to the exponential pattern; any aggregation that preserves in-
formation only about the geometric mean attracts to the power law pattern.

http://arxiv.org/pdf/0906.3507.pdf
 
apeiron said:
There are good reasons why the patterns of nature fall into either normal or powerlaw distributions.

Thank you!

Andre said:
Interesting thought. But be very wary, and maybe do a bit of research of success rate of forecasting with models, weather for instance.

But maybe there is a general semi random pattern in corporation/people/nation cycles, genesis, growth, thriving, high noon/gold age, decay, collapse, termination. Just two cents.

Are there any articles on quantitative history that I can look at? Everything else other than the posted article is behind a paywall...
 
chill_factor said:
These parameters can be influenced by major events such as a stock market shock or technological breakthrough. I was wondering if it was possible to predict the fortunes of a company or a country while accounting for these major events, a sort of "corrected" Brownian motion through the chosen parameter.

The import of Frank's paper is that from a sufficient distance (take a large enough class of events) and individual events are random. The issue then is to decide what kind of randomness applies.

If you want a more introductory approach to this issue - and from a financial markets perspective - Nassim Nicholas Taleb's books are an easy read...

http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/

This is also a good paper on powerlaws (since you focus on Brownian motion)...

Power laws, Pareto distributions and Zipf’s law
M. E. J. Newman
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/cond-mat/pdf/0412/0412004v3.pdf
 
thank you greatly, these papers are very useful for me.
 

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