Digital Cameras: Recording Progress on Drawing in One Day

[zoobyshoe]

Always mad love of your art:!)

Thank you much, dear.

I found the trick of the photo projector from the art class I took in my late 30's. But all it gives you is reference points. If you don't have talent, it doesn't help. Until then I had done everything freehand. All but 2 people quit the class, the last walking by me and snorting out "I thought this class was for beginners". I *was* a beginner. Now my oldest daughter, the artist, has stolen my projector.

Yes, however you get, or don't get, the proportions, how you flesh them out makes a world of difference. A friend I have here in San Diego can eyeball proportions as well as me. She can also capture level of light and dark (value) about as well as me. She loses her patience when it comes to shading and skin tone, though, so her renderings have a "skritchy-scratchy" texture, despite the fact the overall values and proportions are about the same as mine.

You have a rare gift zoob, an absolutely incredible gift for capturing the life of the object.

I'm very happy you think so! Thanks so much!

 

[lisab]

Zooby, do you sell your art?

 

[zoobyshoe]

Zooby, do you sell your art?

Not much, no. I was born lacking the "peddler" gene. I don't do commissions because I want to draw faces that appeal to me on my own terms.

When I lived in Minneapolis years back I got into a few juried group shows (you had to pass a jury to get hung in the show). Once in, you could put any price you wanted on your work and it was for sale to the public who came to the show. I sold three pieces back then that way. I also had a piece in a real art gallery for a while back then, but it didn't sell.

At this point I'm working on the idea of selling inexpensive framed prints of the ones that seem to be most popular.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

Portrait Of Kristina:
When I first saw this girl in the cafe where I hang out I was stunned: I couldn't believe a girl with such a big nose could be so hot.

I was rather stunned by the picture. I have no issue with big noses either. They can be kind of sexy in my opinion. I like faces with character.

And of course your drawings are great as usual. :-)

 

[DaveC426913]

I like faces with character.

For me, http://rebelsofmars.blogs.com/rebels_of_mars/images/2007/06/09/barkin1.jpg" do it.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I was rather stunned by the picture. I have no issue with big noses either. They can be kind of sexy in my opinion. I like faces with character.

Usually when we perceive a nose to be "too big" we are judging it to be disproportionately large for the face in question. In Kristina's case there is no sense she's pretty "despite" her nose, she makes it work so that I feel she's attractive because of her nose. I can't figure out why it can be too big by all standards, and yet simultaneously so attractive.

And of course your drawings are great as usual. :-)

Thanks very much! Kind of you to say so.

 

[Dembadon]

Zooby,

What amazing manifestations of artistic talent! Your shading is phenomenal. Your humility adds to the already impressive nature of your work. Please, continue to share!

 

[waht]

Zooby, thank you for sharing your artwork. They are all stimulating on a subconscious level and project a set of emotions which are just out of reach in the ordinary sense of the word.

 

[rewebster]

Not much, no. I was born lacking the "peddler" gene. I don't do commissions because I want to draw faces that appeal to me on my own terms.

When I lived in Minneapolis years back I got into a few juried group shows (you had to pass a jury to get hung in the show). Once in, you could put any price you wanted on your work and it was for sale to the public who came to the show. I sold three pieces back then that way. I also had a piece in a real art gallery for a while back then, but it didn't sell.

At this point I'm working on the idea of selling inexpensive framed prints of the ones that seem to be most popular.

funny--I thought the same way about my commissions at first, then realized that people knew my works and wanted me to paint them my way.

I did prints for prints sake (multiples like etchings, and a lot of silkscreens), but people wanted some type of 'original' work, ---and, sold quite a few paintings as I knew I could always paint more and get better at painting at the same time the more I painted. I did the 'shows' (one man gallery, about 5 or 6) but didn't sell much----I sold stuff mostly through commissions through people who had or had seen commissioned work.

But, it depends on what your long range plans are, I guess.

I read a book about "Art and Photography" in college and a lot of artists going way back (and also in the three years I was in the college 'studio' setting) used photographs (and grids) --I think even Cezanne and Monet even photoed and gridded. Picasso's profile/full face 'thing' that he used for a LONG time came from a double exposure negative of a woman who moved during a long exposure in one of those old cameras.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

For me, http://rebelsofmars.blogs.com/rebels_of_mars/images/2007/06/09/barkin1.jpg" do it.

Those are attractive too. Here is a good example of an attractive nosy model I found recently.

Usually when we perceive a nose to be "too big" we are judging it to be disproportionately large for the face in question. In Kristina's case there is no sense she's pretty "despite" her nose, she makes it work so that I feel she's attractive because of her nose. I can't figure out why it can be too big by all standards, and yet simultaneously so attractive.

I've found that they work very well for [East] Indian women. I often find them very attractive. There are some other ethnic backgrounds that seem to have faces quite suited for larger noses as well.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Zooby,

What amazing manifestations of artistic talent! Your shading is phenomenal. Your humility adds to the already impressive nature of your work. Please, continue to share!

I'm extremely pleased you like it and thanks for the wonderful compliments! I will post more.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Zooby, thank you for sharing your artwork. They are all stimulating on a subconscious level and project a set of emotions which are just out of reach in the ordinary sense of the word.

You're very welcome!

I'm glad you have that reaction because I'm always going for both an immediate impact and motion toward deeper psychological layers.

 

[zoobyshoe]

funny--I thought the same way about my commissions at first, then realized that people knew my works and wanted me to paint them my way.

I find people want to be flattered. This puts me at odds with them because I am more interested in "character study".

I read a book about "Art and Photography" in college and a lot of artists going way back (and also in the three years I was in the college 'studio' setting) used photographs (and grids) --I think even Cezanne and Monet even photoed and gridded. Picasso's profile/full face 'thing' that he used for a LONG time came from a double exposure negative of a woman who moved during a long exposure in one of those old cameras.

David Hockney wrote a large book about various mechanical and optical means of copying proportions that go back to the pre-Renaissance, and I have another book that goes into a detailed history of the well known artists who started using photographic references instead of live models just about as soon as photography became available to the amateur.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I've found that they work very well for [East] Indian women. I often find them very attractive. There are some other ethnic backgrounds that seem to have faces quite suited for larger noses as well.

Kristina's magnificent nose is not ethnic. It's broken, actually. She fell at 17 while trying to imitate a ballet dancer.

It's funny because we never discussed her nose till way after the drawing was finished. I only recently found out that history.

 

[rewebster]

I find people want to be flattered. This puts me at odds with them because I am more interested in "character study".



David Hockney wrote a large book about various mechanical and optical means of copying proportions that go back to the pre-Renaissance, and I have another book that goes into a detailed history of the well known artists who started using photographic references instead of live models just about as soon as photography became available to the amateur.

That's one thing about art---there are no rules (for its creation). We used to have discussions late into the night about it sitting around the school's studio--and plenty of coffee.

I've seen daguerreotypes (c 1840's to 1860's) even completely painted over by an artist keeping the proportions exact. I've even seen some grid patterns left visible and apparent by the artist as the finished piece.

I've liked Chuck Close's pieces---they're almost overwhelming in person, and Warhol's 'portraits' are really color fields applied to a photo---what's interesting is when a group of artists are given the exact same image, and the variety of end products come out due to each artist's interpretation.

 

[drizzle]

OK, here it is:

"Ivan Seeking Searches The Astral Lost And Found"

Very cool Zooby!

Where is my nose?

Nice drawings Zshoe :)

 

[zoobyshoe]

That's one thing about art---there are no rules (for its creation). We used to have discussions late into the night about it sitting around the school's studio--and plenty of coffee.

There are 'rules' (standards, procedures, techniques), but they're different for, and personal to, each individual artist.

Some 'rules' are perverted: I've run into a lot of beginners who have the weird notion that it's "cheating" to even look at an object. In other words, they actually believe it's not "art" unless you make it up completely out of your head. This is a terrible meme to stick in someone's mind because these same people all judge themselves to be inept, since they can't do it, and have been psychologically cut off from the only way anyone can learn to render.

I've seen daguerreotypes (c 1840's to 1860's) even completely painted over by an artist keeping the proportions exact.

Painting directly over a photo is taking "photographic reference" too far, in my opinion.

I've liked Chuck Close's pieces---they're almost overwhelming in person,

Early Chuck Close was astonishing: he turned "snapshot" poses of ordinary people into monumental experiences.

and Warhol's 'portraits' are really color fields applied to a photo---

Warhol's not about rendering, though: he was about "exclusivity"; clique psychology. He was a master manipulator of that. His highly artificial persona was his art. He made it work for him during his life, but I think the physical artworks he presented are highly forgettable.

what's interesting is when a group of artists are given the exact same image, and the variety of end products come out due to each artist's interpretation.

Yes, PencilPortraitClub at deviantART has had contests where everyone draws the same reference photo. The differences between one rendering and the next demonstrates it's not about realism, but about the elements of art: line, form, rhythm, color, texture, balance, etc. and about the artist's emotional reaction to the subject.

 

[lisab]

There are 'rules' (standards, procedures, techniques), but they're different for, and personal to, each individual artist.

Some 'rules' are perverted: I've run into a lot of beginners who have the weird notion that it's "cheating" to even look at an object. In other words, they actually believe it's not "art" unless you make it up completely out of your head. This is a terrible meme to stick in someone's mind because these same people all judge themselves to be inept, since they can't do it, and have been psychologically cut off from the only way anyone can learn to render.

I have a niece who has great talent for drawing. The family tried in vain to get her to study art in college. But she believed that "real" artists don't need classes, so she refused to take any formal training. What a shame!

 

[rewebster]

Someone asked me 'what style of painting' was my stuff when I was putting together one of the shows. It got me thinking as I couldn't place a 'style' on it. I liked the Pre-Raphaelites, the Surrealists, the Romantics (like Church)---and I came up with 'Surromanticism', I think back in 1975, which I put on about 100 posters (silkscreen images) announcing the exhibition---I had to go back several times to put more up. People were taking them down like souvenirs.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I have a niece who has great talent for drawing. The family tried in vain to get her to study art in college. But she believed that "real" artists don't need classes, so she refused to take any formal training. What a shame!

The real trouble with her attitude is probably that it's symptomatic of a "loner" tendency, which means she'll have, perhaps insurmountable, problems marketing her stuff. People don't rush into financially support or employ good artists. Getting paid for it is a completely separate, quite distinct talent weirdly unrelated to how good your art is. I've been trying to wrap my mind around that paradox for years.

I know several artists here who are amazingly good, and who went to school, but who can't manage to make any money, and I believe it's simply because they lack the marketing skills.

 

[zomgwtf]

The real trouble with her attitude is probably that it's symptomatic of a "loner" tendency, which means she'll have, perhaps insurmountable, problems marketing her stuff. People don't rush into financially support or employ good artists. Getting paid for it is a completely separate, quite distinct talent weirdly unrelated to how good your art is. I've been trying to wrap my mind around that paradox for years.

I know several artists here who are amazingly good, and who went to school, but who can't manage to make any money, and I believe it's simply because they lack the marketing skills.

I agree with this. I like to draw and paint but it's only a hobby I have, my stuff isn't nearly as good as what you've posted in here (drawing a portrait for me takes about an hour so it's really just a sketch) but I've had people offer me money to draw them various portraits. Even though I could suggest to them extremely talented artist who would do a much better job for some reason they ask myself. I think it's because one time I drew a portrait for my girlfriend and some people saw it and never knew I could draw before.

Anyways a great way I've noticed for artists to get recognized and a good way to market their skills as an artist is to post video of themselves doing their work on YouTube. It's an extremely powerful tool I've found for marketing and several artist have already jumped on it.


As well zooby very nice drawings I wish I had the patience to be able to continue drawing after I finish sketching everything as well as being able to shade half as well as you .

 

[zoobyshoe]

Anyways a great way I've noticed for artists to get recognized and a good way to market their skills as an artist is to post video of themselves doing their work on YouTube. It's an extremely powerful tool I've found for marketing and several artist have already jumped on it.

It seems like a good idea, but do you actually know if they're selling their work because of it?

As well zooby very nice drawings I wish I had the patience to be able to continue drawing after I finish sketching everything as well as being able to shade half as well as you .

What works for me is to just pick one part of a face: an eye, a nose, a mouth, and spend an hour drawing that one part. If you spend a whole hour on just one eye, that eye is going to be a well shaded, well rendered eye. I prolly have hundreds of sketches like that: just an eye, a nose, or a mouth. Do that enough and when you go to do a whole face it is more natural to spend that much time on each part, and bring the whole thing to a greater level of finish.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Continuing with the update, here is the new direction I started experimenting with about six months ago: a fusion of the colored pencil stuff with the portraits.



"Lust For Fruit"

 

[zomgwtf]

Continuing with the update, here is the new direction I started experimenting with about six months ago: a fusion of the colored pencil stuff with the portraits.



"Lust For Fruit"

That is probably my favorite piece you've posted. Fantastic

@your question about the other people selling their work. I'm not sure exactly how much of their sales would come from YouTube videos but they do sell their skills quite often. Sometimes people even request to buy the piece they had done for the demonstration. The reason I'm not sure how much come from the videos is because it's mostly done over the internet anyways. So you can't see if they are emailing because they saw his website, or his deviantart page, or a YouTube video or maybe the person knows them personally. Normally costs around 50-100$ for a portrait with one face (ones I've heard of). For each additional subject in the portrait there is an additional fee.

As well thanks for the tips while I was taking art courses I had to do exactly that but the teacher only made us do it for the eyes. I can see what you mean about it becoming more 'natural' after that approach because I feel comfortable drawing eyes. However I don't really like sitting for an extremely long time drawing and not getting results after putting in much of my time . I'll for sure get back to sketching various parts of the face though.

 

[rewebster]

hey, zooby, have you done any lithography? it can be an effective medium for drawing in the way of making duplicates. There's zinc plates sort of like copper (for intaglio, etchings, engravings, aquatints, etc.) that are used rather than two hundred pound slabs of Bavarian limestone. --and with multiple printings on the same sheet, color can be incorporated

 

[turbo]

I know several artists here who are amazingly good, and who went to school, but who can't manage to make any money, and I believe it's simply because they lack the marketing skills.

I have a friend who is a very talented artist. He has done some fabulous murals, and he worked for Hallmark for years before going out on his own. So how does he put food on the table? Sign-painting. His art just won't support him in this environment. It's sad. I could easily have supported myself playing music around here, until the fragrance sensitivities got bad, but graphic arts? Nope.

 

[zoobyshoe]

City Of Night

"Are you a lucky little lady in the City of Light?
Or just another lost angel: City of Night?"

-The Doors, L.A. Woman

I'm starting to think of this style as "Deco-Expressionism" or Expressionistic Deco.

 

[zoobyshoe]

That is probably my favorite piece you've posted. Fantastic

Thanks much! These things are getting more attention at the cafe where I sit and draw than any other previous ones.

@your question about the other people selling their work. I'm not sure exactly how much of their sales would come from YouTube videos but they do sell their skills quite often. Sometimes people even request to buy the piece they had done for the demonstration. The reason I'm not sure how much come from the videos is because it's mostly done over the internet anyways. So you can't see if they are emailing because they saw his website, or his deviantart page, or a YouTube video or maybe the person knows them personally. Normally costs around 50-100$ for a portrait with one face (ones I've heard of). For each additional subject in the portrait there is an additional fee.

I guess I'd just have to try it and see what results.

However I don't really like sitting for an extremely long time drawing and not getting results after putting in much of my time.

The result you want to shoot for is quality not quantity. Da Vinci worked on the Mona Lisa for years and years.

hey, zooby, have you done any lithography? it can be an effective medium for drawing in the way of making duplicates. There's zinc plates sort of like copper (for intaglio, etchings, engravings, aquatints, etc.) that are used rather than two hundred pound slabs of Bavarian limestone. --and with multiple printings on the same sheet, color can be incorporated

I've read up on pretty much all the duplication processes. I think offset printing is what I want: the more you have printed the cheaper each copy becomes and that makes a copy affordable for anyone. The huge popularity of people like Escher and Dali and Frieda Kahlo is largely made possible by the fact their works are available in inexpensive poster form that even high school and college kids can afford.

I have a friend who is a very talented artist. He has done some fabulous murals, and he worked for Hallmark for years before going out on his own. So how does he put food on the table? Sign-painting. His art just won't support him in this environment. It's sad. I could easily have supported myself playing music around here, until the fragrance sensitivities got bad, but graphic arts? Nope.

Yeah, the few artists I know who get a paycheck for it are graphic artists, but the competition is still quite stiff, and much of the work is "bi*ch-work", as the youngster's call it. It's easier than ever since so much layout work is 100% digital now, but a graphic artist is basically relegated to working out the clumsy visions of people who aren't artists.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Deco Nocturne:

 

[zomgwtf]

Deco Nocturne:

Wow.

I love the expression in the face too.

zooby do you do any paints or work with pastels etc.?