Distance analogy - am I being accurate?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the accuracy and effectiveness of an analogy comparing the distance between hydrogen atoms in the universe to distances familiar to human experience, particularly in the context of a school talk. Participants explore the scientific basis of the analogy and its potential for clarity in communication.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the average distance between hydrogen atoms can be scaled to human dimensions, suggesting a comparison of 1100 AU.
  • Another participant challenges the diameter of a hydrogen atom provided, suggesting it is more akin to the diameter of a proton rather than the stated value.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the usefulness of the analogy, noting that distances like 1100 AU may not be intuitively grasped by children.
  • Suggestions are made to use smaller objects, such as a pea or grain of salt, to create a more relatable analogy for distance comparisons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the analogy may not be effective as presented, but there is no consensus on the accuracy of the initial calculations or the best way to frame the analogy for clarity.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved issues regarding the correct diameter of a hydrogen atom and how that impacts the scaling used in the analogy. Additionally, the effectiveness of analogies in conveying scientific concepts remains a point of contention.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for educators, communicators of science, and individuals interested in effective ways to explain complex scientific concepts to younger audiences.

leogarcia61
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Hi guys,

I am giving a schools talk and would like your opinion on whether or not you think the following reasoning is accurate and roughly scientific.

Lets we assume that on average there is only one hydrogen atom per cubic metre on average in the universe. The diameter of a hydrogen atom is 1.7e-15m.

Scaling up to the size of a human, can I say that the distance between hydrogen atoms in the universe is equivalent to:

0.3 (diameter of a small human) / 1.7e-15 = 1.76e14 m = 1100 AU

So the distance between hydrogen atoms in the universe is roughly equivalent to one of the kids standing the classroom and another kid standing 1000 times further away than we are to the sun (or if you can think of a better landmark to use I'd appreciate it! Mine is quite clumsy)

Does that logic hold, or is it outright wrong?

Thanks,

Leo
 
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leogarcia61 said:
The diameter of a hydrogen atom is 1.7e-15m.

That's not right. More like an angstrom.
 
Vanadium 50 said:
That's not right. More like an angstrom.

Wikipedia says 2.4 A, so I'm wrong either way. But aside from that - can I use this as a useful analogy?
 
I think what you used for diameter of the hydrogen atom is more like diameter of a proton.

The analogy makes sense, but I'm not sure how useful it is. These kind of analogies can be helpful because they put astronomically small or large numbers in some type of context humans have experience with. Even after your scaling, your factor is still 1100AU, which no child (or person, for that matter) has an intuitive grasp of.

Try using something smaller, like a pea or a grain of salt. Maybe then you'll get a distance comparable to that between cities or something. That would greatly increase the usefulness, in my opinion.
 
Nabeshin said:
Even after your scaling, your factor is still 1100AU, which no child (or person, for that matter) has an intuitive grasp of.

Try using something smaller, like a pea or a grain of salt. Maybe then you'll get a distance comparable to that between cities or something. That would greatly increase the usefulness, in my opinion.

I think you have a very good point - there's no point taking an ungraspable analogy and replacing it with another one! I'll see what numbers come out of smaller things like a pea.

Thanks for your advice - I really appreciate it!

Leo