Exploring "The Mathematical Theory of Black Holes" by S. Chandrasekhar

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a theorem presented in S. Chandrasekhar's "The Mathematical Theory of Black Holes," specifically regarding the transformation of a 2-dimensional metric into a diagonal form. Participants explore the derivation methods and coordinate transformations used in the book, seeking clarification on the logic and steps involved.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes their approach to transforming the metric using new contravariant coordinates and expresses confusion about the method presented in the book.
  • Another participant suggests that the equations in the book are specific cases of a general transformation formula and questions the original poster about their understanding of certain equations.
  • A later reply indicates that the participant was able to clarify their understanding after realizing the need to use the definition of a tensor in their derivation.
  • Some participants propose a counting argument regarding the independent components of the metric and the freedom provided by general coordinate transformations to simplify the metric.
  • There is a discussion about the use of covariant coordinates, with one participant questioning this choice while another defends it based on the specific formula being referenced in the book.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the methods of transformation and the appropriateness of using covariant coordinates. There is no consensus on the best approach to derive the diagonal form of the metric.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the derivation involves specific assumptions about coordinate transformations and the nature of the metric, which may not be universally applicable without further clarification.

kparchevsky
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In page 67 of book "The mathematical theory of black holes" by S. Chandrasekhar in chapter 2 "Space-Time of sufficient generality" there is a theorem that metric of a 2-dimensional space
$$ds^2 = g_{11} (dx^1)^2 + 2g_{12} dx^1 dx^2 + g_{22} (dx^2)^2$$
can be brought to a diagonal form.

I would do this in the following way: introduce new contravariant coordinates ##x'## (how ##x## depend on ##x'##) ##x^1 = p(x'^1, x'^2), x^2= q(x'^1, x'^2)##, differentiate them, plug ##dx^1## and ##dx^2## into the metric above, and equate factor at ##dx'^1 dx'^2## to zero.

That is not how it is done in the book. First they introduce new contravariant coordinates ##x'## such that the inverse functions are defined (how ##x'## depend on ##x##) Eq.(6)
$$x'^1=\phi(x^1,x^2),\qquad x'^2=\psi(x^1,x^2)$$
then they try to reduce to the diagonal form the contravariant form of the metric (##g^{\mu\nu}## with up indexes, ##dx_\mu## with low indexes) Eq.(7),
$$ds^2=g^{11}(dx_1)^2+2g^{12}dx_1dx_2+g^{22}(dx_2)^2$$
though coordinate transformations are defined for contravariant coordinates (up indexes).

I cannot follow the logic of the derivation.

Could you help me to understand how it is derived in the book?

Thank you.

[Mentor Note -- New user has been PM'd about posting math using LaTeX and has been pointed to the "LaTeX Guide" link, especially for threads with the "A" prefix]
 
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kparchevsky said:
[...] they introduce new contravariant coordinates ##x'## such that the inverse functions are defined (how ##x'## depend on ##x##) Eq.(6)$$x'^1=\phi(x^1,x^2),\qquad x'^2=\psi(x^1,x^2)$$ then they try to reduce to the diagonal form the contravariant form of the metric (##g^{\mu\nu}## with up indexes, ##dx_\mu## with low indexes) Eq.(7),

kparchevsky said:
$$ ds^2=g^{11}(dx_1)^2+2g^{12}dx_1dx_2+g^{22}(dx_2)^2$$ though coordinate transformations are defined for contravariant coordinates (up indexes). I cannot follow the logic of the derivation.
You didn't say at which equation in the book you get stuck. Do you understand eqs (8) and (9)? They're basically just specific cases of the general transformation formula$$g'^{\mu\nu} ~=~ \frac{\partial x'^\mu}{\partial x^\alpha} \; \frac{\partial x'^\nu}{\partial x^\beta} \; g^{\alpha\beta} ~,$$ although Chandrasekhar uses a notation convention of putting primes on the indices rather than the main symbol as I've done above.
 
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strangerep said:
You didn't say at which equation in the book you get stuck. Do you understand eqs (8) and (9)? They're basically just specific cases of the general transformation formula$$g'^{\mu\nu} ~=~ \frac{\partial x'^\mu}{\partial x^\alpha} \; \frac{\partial x'^\nu}{\partial x^\beta} \; g^{\alpha\beta} ~,$$ although Chandrasekhar uses a notation convention of putting primes on the indices rather than the main symbol as I've done above.
Thank you. Trying to prove Eq.(8) I took differential from both sides of Eq.(6), solved it for ##dx^i##, converted it to ##dx_i##, plugged into Eq.(7) and zeroed term at ##dx'^i dx'^j##, but I just had to use the definition of a tensor! The rest of derivation in the book is clear.
 
Can't you just see this by counting? In 2 dimensions the metric has 1/2×2×3=3 independent components. With 2 general coordinate transformations (gct's) you have enough freedom to put one component to zero. Explicitly you can write down the transformed compononent for g_12, put it to zero, and see what constraints you get for the gct. This partially gauge fixes the gct's.

I don't get why you use "covariant coordinates" in the first place. For a similar calculation, see any book on string theory how to gauge fix the worldsheet metric and why this implicates that string theory is a CFT.
 
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haushofer said:
Can't you just see this by counting? In 2 dimensions the metric has 1/2×2×3=3 independent components. With 2 general coordinate transformations (gct's) you have enough freedom to put one component to zero. Explicitly you can write down the transformed compononent for g_12, put it to zero, and see what constraints you get for the gct. This partially gauge fixes the gct's.

I don't get why you use "covariant coordinates" in the first place. For a similar calculation, see any book on string theory how to gauge fix the worldsheet metric and why this implicates that string theory is a CFT.
>I don't get why you use "covariant coordinates" in the first place
The goal was to prove the specific formula in the specific book, and this formula was written in covariant coordinates.
 

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