Hardness of Neutronium: Estimating Magnitude

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around estimating the hardness of neutronium, particularly in the context of neutron stars and their unique physical properties. Participants explore theoretical frameworks, comparisons to known materials, and the implications of degeneracy pressure in extreme environments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the hardness of neutronium on Mohs' scale and suggests that the hardness could be related to the extreme conditions in neutron stars.
  • Another participant questions how to quantify the hardness of neutronium, proposing that counter-pressure could serve as a measure and emphasizing the philosophical nature of such estimates.
  • A participant asserts that neutronium is largely a science fiction concept and highlights the uncertainty surrounding the nature of neutron star interiors, suggesting it may not translate to earthly hardness measures.
  • One participant references the Pauli exclusion principle and degeneracy pressure, noting that neutrons exhibit a significantly higher bulk modulus than diamond, which may provide insight into their hardness.
  • Another participant mentions that neutron stars have a solid crust but a liquid interior, indicating that the core may not be the best place to assess hardness.
  • A participant speculates on the hardness of quark combinations within neutrons compared to protons and discusses the implications of weak force strength and particle stability.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature and hardness of neutronium, with no consensus reached on how to quantify its hardness or the implications of its properties in relation to known materials.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about neutronium and neutron star interiors, as well as the dependence on theoretical models that may not directly apply to observable measures of hardness.

jquark
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on Mohs' scale what is the hardness of neutronium in its native environment?

we record the mass of a teaspoon full, so compared to the ratio of EM to gravity, what is the next level to fermi gas of degenerate matter? just how hard is it? an order of magnitude estimate will be fine. seems if a mountain on a 15km pulsar would be a millimeter and if it shifted on a magnetar it would blast (gee it doesn't have symbol font) [tex]\gamma[/tex] rays across the galaxy, it must be...unusual. [tex]\gamma[\tex] i am now an official texican.[/tex]
 
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i wasnt being facetious.

similar to the charge mass ratio of the electron, what is the next ratio to this state? how strong is the weak force?

gravitationally speaking how much mass does a neutron star have, we can start with the core as a natural environment. what kind of pressure is there? counter-pressure would be a good measure of hardness. within some philosophical order of magnitude. (in other words, the numbers are probably accurate but its our minds...)

i ran into the equations for relativistic stars a while ago i may run into them again sometime.
 
Neutronium is science fiction. You can derive an equation of state for the surface of a neutron star, but, it does not translate into earthly measures like mohr's hardness. The nature of neutron star interiors is very uncertain. It may be fairly similar to the surface, or an exotic quark soup.
 
I don't know the hardness of "neutronium" but here's a quote from wiki, about pauli's exclusion principle, and our friendly neutron star.

Astronomy provides another spectacular demonstration of this effect, in the form of white dwarf stars and neutron stars. For both such bodies, their usual atomic structure is disrupted by large gravitational forces, leaving the constituents supported by "degeneracy pressure" alone. This exotic form of matter is known as degenerate matter. In white dwarfs, the atoms are held apart by the degeneracy pressure of the electrons. In neutron stars, which exhibit even larger gravitational forces, the electrons have merged with the protons to form neutrons, which produce a larger degeneracy pressure. Neutrons are the most "rigid" objects known - their Young modulus (or more accurately, bulk modulus) is 20 orders of magnitude larger than that of diamond.

That should give you a small idea of its hardness.
 
excellent. i couldn't remember names of other scales. i ran across something in a book review i believe about this kind of thing, saying that neutron stars' exterior is a solid crust, but the interior is more of a dense liquid. so the core wouldn't quite be the place to look.

that was well written it almost sounded like sagan talking for most of it.

thank you :) element number zero.
 
i was looking at some fields, with three quarks in the neutron, that combination of them must be harder than the set for the proton. weak force is so strong.

and still half life of a proton 10^33y if that and neutron 15 min or so.

they can hold back a near-black hole wow