How do we equip our pioneers on new worlds?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Noisy Rhysling
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges and considerations for equipping pioneers on new worlds, exploring the practicality of technology versus biological solutions, and the implications of different planetary environments. Participants engage in speculative reasoning about the tools, animals, and strategies that might be employed in extraterrestrial colonization efforts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that advanced technology like robotic tractors and flying cars may not be practical without existing infrastructure on new worlds.
  • Heinlein's idea of using genetically enhanced animals for transport and labor is proposed as a viable option for pioneers.
  • Concerns are raised about the weight of pioneers and equipment on larger planets, potentially complicating colonization efforts.
  • One participant humorously suggests that a Samurai sword could be a useful tool for survival, raising questions about the practicality of such an item in a new environment.
  • There is a discussion about the historical context of explorers and how their equipment was influenced by the technology of their time, suggesting that future pioneers may face similar limitations.
  • Another viewpoint emphasizes the potential for genetic engineering to create suitable plants and animals for specific environments, proposing that frozen embryos and seeds could be utilized.
  • Participants reflect on the notion that colonization efforts would depend on prior knowledge of the environments and challenges of new worlds.
  • Heinlein's analogy of westward expansion in the US is referenced, suggesting that pioneers would need the same daring spirit to adapt to new planets.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the best approaches to equipping pioneers, with no clear consensus on whether technology or biological solutions are preferable. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing ideas presented.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the speculative nature of the discussion, reliance on hypothetical scenarios, and the absence of concrete information regarding the environments of new worlds.

Noisy Rhysling
Messages
999
Reaction score
345
We routinely see pioneers with all kinds of cool tech gear, robotic tractors and flying cars.

But would this be the best option on a new world? Without the infrastructure to support the cool gadgets would they be practical? Heinlein posited that pioneers, especially the leading edge of the outward expansion from Prime Base should be equipped with animals for draft and transport that could produce more animals. Genetically enhanced animals would be the prime candidates, and hybrids that could breed true would be part of the mix.

So, are these the extremes and there's a middle ground? Would doctors necessarily double at veterinarians? And would one such make a good protagonist?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
I have the feeling that beside different atmospheres there will be an issue with weight, animal or human. Many worlds are simply bigger than Earth and pioneers would weigh significantly more than on earth. Plus the fewer weight in space during the long journey, it will soon get an unsolvable problem. Hooray, we made it! Too bad we can't move anymore.
 
fresh_42 said:
I have the feeling that beside different atmospheres there will be an issue with weight, animal or human. Many worlds are simply bigger than Earth and pioneers would weigh significantly more than on earth. Plus the fewer weight in space during the long journey, it will soon get an unsolvable problem. Hooray, we made it! Too bad we can't move anymore.
Van Buskirk and his Valerians didn't have any problems. :biggrin:

I don't think we'll try to colonize planets we can't live on.
 
I'm not sure this reply fits your question, but brainstorming new writings is a good thing.

One of the thoughts I've had if I were teleported somewhere naked and alone, and I could only take one thing with me, I would choose a Samurai sword. It's big enough for self defense against most predators, and can be used for cutting small branches for making shelters and sleeping beds. I haven't been able to think of another modern implement that would be a better choice. :smile:
 
BTW, it's also good for hunting, since you can just walk up to a pride of predators and offer yourself as dinner. Then have your own dinner after the fight. :smile:
 
Last edited:
My threads aren't patrolled. And I like that idea. I bought a set of swords in Japan, after a year of negotiation. The shop owner didn't even let gaijin in his shop, sailors were pretty much idiots around sharp implements. So I just stood outside the shop and looked in, every day. After three months of this he let me in and I showed him I wasn't a baka. He got me into a kendo class and they beat me up for a few months. Then he let me hold a sword. (I scored big by not trying to unsheath it.) Finally he sold me a set, and I still have them, 33 years later.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
Nice. I've wanted to take Kendo lessons to support my thought. Having the sword and having to guess at how best to use it would not work all that well when faced with a pride of Velocitorapors...
 
berkeman said:
Nice. I've wanted to take Kendo lessons to support my thought. Having the sword and having to guess at how best to use it would not work all that well when faced with a pride of Velocitorapors...
I can't get this picture out of my head, you practicing in a near forest, merely equipped with a sword, naked, looking for prey.
Or the other way round: some alien arriving with only a sword in his hand, trying to make his way through LA or NYC.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: berkeman
fresh_42 said:
I can't get this picture out of my head, you practicing in a near forest, merely equipped with a sword, naked, looking for prey.
I got arrested for something like that once... :smile:

My claims about the time machine didn't carry much weight with the officers, unfortunately...
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: fresh_42
  • #10
Back to the topic and as I just watch a documentary in which James C. Maxwell occurred. All explorers, researchers and pioneers (Roald E.G. Amundsen, Charles R. Darwin, F.W.H. Alexander v. Humboldt and so on) always have been dressed and equipped by the fashion of their time and guided by what they then have thought of to be appropriate. I think that will not change and will always look strange in retrospect.
Therefore we are restricted by what we can imagine and not necessarily by actual needs.

When writing a science fiction novel it might be interesting to invent something entirely new.

Edit: A kind of Swiss army knife for extraterrestrial use.
 
  • #11
Riffing on the idea of taking (potentially genetically enhanced) animals (and plants) for particular purposes:
Presumably being in the future, you will have more technical options.
Freeze several different kinds of plants (seeds) and animals (as frozen embryos).
Depending on the biology, the genetics involved, and the skills of the outer space adventurers, these frozen starting materials could then be modified by genetic engineering (Bones might also be the vet/botanist) to yield organisms useful in the particular environment encountered.
The required DNA sequences could be made on site.

Plants are probably a better bet that animals (as in The Martian) in many cases (prey not required).

I would expect a well equipped ship or if not a ship, a bunch of stuff would be going with the traveler (and more than one person).

The idea of not colonizing places you can't live in implies some knowledge of the environments and challenges that would be encountered, thus appropriate plans would be possible.
 
  • #12
Heinlein's idea, as I remember it, was that we would set off on a new planet in the same way settlers headed west from the US Atlantic coast. The adventurous ones leap-frogged the advancing "frontier" into areas with little or no infrastructure. To bend a new planet to our will would take the same daring souls, I think. And it might progress at the same rate, depending on how quickly the industrial base on that planet developed. It would probably be impractical, barring surprises in interstellar transportation, to haul "sod buster" plows from planet to planet.

And, as with any speculation without hard information, I could be wildly wrong. And that's where a good scifi story would be born.