Discussion Overview
The discussion centers on how the Hartree model incorporates the Pauli exclusion principle, particularly in relation to the symmetry properties of the wavefunction used in the Hartree approximation. Participants explore the implications of the approximation on the treatment of fermions and the nature of the wavefunctions involved.
Discussion Character
- Technical explanation
- Debate/contested
Main Points Raised
- One participant asserts that the Hartree approximation uses a symmetric product wavefunction, which leads to the conclusion that it effectively ignores the Pauli exclusion principle.
- Another participant suggests that the Pauli exclusion principle is partially accounted for because the occupied orbitals in the Hartree model are all different.
- A claim is made that when the Hartree approximation considers the Pauli exclusion principle, it transitions to what is referred to as the Hartree-Fock approximation, which provides an antisymmetric wavefunction.
- A correction is issued regarding the terminology, clarifying that the correct term is "Fock" instead of "jock" in reference to the Hartree-Fock approximation.
- One participant reiterates the initial claim about the wavefunction's symmetry properties, stating that in the Hartree approximation, the wavefunction is neither symmetric nor antisymmetric.
Areas of Agreement / Disagreement
Participants express differing views on how the Hartree approximation relates to the Pauli exclusion principle, with no consensus reached on the extent to which the principle is accounted for in the model.
Contextual Notes
There are unresolved questions regarding the definitions and implications of the wavefunction's symmetry in the context of the Hartree and Hartree-Fock approximations.